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Unfortunately the business case for EVs is currently still not a very good one, and demand is not yet THAT high despite all the press hype. Every manufacturer is moving in this direction, but more widespread adoption of EVs is most likely going to be driven by market access issues and not demand.

The idiots at VW were really effective in killing diesel, which is now on its way out in Europe at least (it'll take years still). But more importantly, European cities and gradually countries are starting to announce bans on combustion engines. Cities and Municipalities in China are starting to do the same....and over there they will probably flick the switch overnight and won't give manufacturers years worth of notice.

The fear of suddenly being shut out of markets like Beijing, Shanghai, etc. is what will accelerate EV introduction.

When it comes to autonomous vehicles, it all depends how you define the word. Tesla has been unbelievably reckless in claiming autonomous capabilities. I believe they have stage 3 autonomous tech, which is similar to what you would find in various other high end cars. No engineers at other companies would have claimed what Tesla did, and guess what, it resulted in death. Real autonomous cars the way the general public thinks of them when they hear the word (stage 5, requiring zero driver input or attention) are still a long way off. Big issues are not only technical but also ethical - I.e. who makes the decisions on how to program an autonomous car to react in critical situations, and what should the cars be programmed to prioritize especially when they share the road with non-autonomous vehicles (e.g. Should they car swerve left to avoid a human crossing the road and hit a truck, thereby saving the pedestrian but killing the passenger?).

Anyway, very exciting times in the industry.
quote:
Originally posted by shavez:
Unfortunately the business case for EVs is currently still not a very good one, and demand is not yet THAT high despite all the press hype. Every manufacturer is moving in this direction, but more widespread adoption of EVs is most likely going to be driven by market access issues and not demand.

The idiots at VW were really effective in killing diesel, which is now on its way out in Europe at least (it'll take years still). But more importantly, European cities and gradually countries are starting to announce bans on combustion engines. Cities and Municipalities in China are starting to do the same....and over there they will probably flick the switch overnight and won't give manufacturers years worth of notice.

The fear of suddenly being shut out of markets like Beijing, Shanghai, etc. is what will accelerate EV introduction.

When it comes to autonomous vehicles, it all depends how you define the word. Tesla has been unbelievably reckless in claiming autonomous capabilities. I believe they have stage 3 autonomous tech, which is similar to what you would find in various other high end cars. No engineers at other companies would have claimed what Tesla did, and guess what, it resulted in death. Real autonomous cars the way the general public thinks of them when they hear the word (stage 5, requiring zero driver input or attention) are still a long way off. Big issues are not only technical but also ethical - I.e. who makes the decisions on how to program an autonomous car to react in critical situations, and what should the cars be programmed to prioritize especially when they share the road with non-autonomous vehicles (e.g. Should they car swerve left to avoid a human crossing the road and hit a truck, thereby saving the pedestrian but killing the passenger?).

Anyway, very exciting times in the industry.


I was wondering when you would jump in! Cool
quote:
Originally posted by ThistlinTom:
You might even see a change in ownership of vehicles.


I forgot to mention ownership. This is already changing. Fewer kids (and young adults for that matter) are even interested in getting drivers licenses. Car sharing and, increasingly, ride sharing services provide sufficient mobility for many, especially in cities that also have good public transit. That lowers costs a lot for people with limited incomes... So it is common sense for car ownership to decline in cities, and this will only accelerate as sharing services improve and offer mobility more or less on demand.

And beyond these facts, owning a car (or anything about cars for that matter) is just not as cool as it used to be for many, especially those under 25 years old.
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
Looking at the Infiniti QX60. Anyone have one?

I was considering buying a Q60. I know it is a completely different body style vs the QX60, but the Q60 drives & handles real nice. The main issue for me proved to be the thought of squeezing into the rear seat to clean the rear window - which seemed best left to acrobats.

The other thing I didn't care for was the blind-spot detection system. It warned me about a vehicle's presence barely in time to prevent a collision (but possibly not a heart attack). I asked if it was possible to adjust the sensitivity of the system and got a negative answer. I suspect that this system might be the same for all their models, so you might see what you think of it on the one you are considering buying.
I’m getting ready to be in the market for a second car and am actually at a bit of a loss as to what to get.

We have a MB ML350 diesel which handles the majority of our family driving. We need something though that can fit our 7 and 3 year olds along with their car/booster seats but for cross town trips not hours long trips. Also has to be useable during the winter (but that’s a low bar, outside of snow days I’d daily drive a Ferrari if I had a chance). So it doesn’t need to be exceptionally practicable and I prefer rare/unique/interesting (though not something that is going to make my mechanic happier than me). Really its main use would be something nice for my wife and I to drive in to work together with every day, for those other times when it’s just my wife and I going somewhere and have the ability to pick up or drop off the boys when two cars are needed.

Would prefer used (love someone else’s depreciation) but would prefer being able to lease/finance. Budget is about $40-60k. I”ve been thinking hard about a 911, maybe a BMW 6 series Grande Coupe, a smaller battery Tesla S…

What else should I be looking at?
quote:
Originally posted by wine+art:
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
Looking at the Infiniti QX60. Anyone have one?


Two MB’s for us J, but our Santa Fe neighbor has one and she loves it. She has the AWD.


Thanks on the vine and W+A. We want the 3rd row availability since the kids are getting are getting older. It seems to hit the sweet spot between the "luxury" suvs and not being crazy expensive to lease. Its actually less than the Acura MDX, Volks Atlas and Toyota Highlander.
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
quote:
Originally posted by wine+art:
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
Looking at the Infiniti QX60. Anyone have one?


Two MB’s for us J, but our Santa Fe neighbor has one and she loves it. She has the AWD.


Thanks on the vine and W+A. We want the 3rd row availability since the kids are getting are getting older. It seems to hit the sweet spot between the "luxury" suvs and not being crazy expensive to lease. Its actually less than the Acura MDX, Volks Atlas and Toyota Highlander.


The Mrs. has a 2010 QX56 that is getting long in the tooth, but she's had it since almost new.
She came from an MDX and we were a long time Acura family.

The long and short of it was/is that MDX drove like a luxury sedan and the QX56 drove like a Mack truck. It still does. It's a beast, and it sounds like a beast. I'm always surprised it doesn't beep when you put in reverse. I refer to it as "the boat". At the time she wanted the biggest thing out there to deal with Atlanta traffic shuttling the kids back and forth to school. She fell in love with the neighbor's Lexus SUV boat and when I came home from a business trip one time she had already been to the dealers and bought one.

More to your question. I hate it, it's a good looking vehicle from the outside, but the fit and finish and luxuriousness paled compared to the Acuras IMO. It has been reliable, its only been in the past year that it has needed anything other than regular maintenance. It was is our first Infinity and I can't see us getting another one. It is big and you can load the entire family and a pair of dogs into it though.
I'd definitely suggest a same day test drive between your contenders.
Interesting that you call it too big. I was very worried about that so I looked up the specs when I started shopping and it was only 6 inches longer than our current Jeep Grand Cherokee. When I did my test drive it didn't feel too big.

Im resigned to something bigger but didn't want to go the Escalade or QX80 route. That's too big for me. At least we aren't getting a minivan.

I do have some sticker shock. Im not a big car person. As long as it gets me from point A to point B and has AC Im good so I keep my cars a long time. I'm 41, have owned a car since I was 16 and have only had 3 cars. When I bought my last one in 2008 it was right after everything had crashed and I got a loaded Jeep Grand Cherokee for $20K. I haven't had a car payment for 4 years. Not looking forward to that again.
I think the Q56 and Q60 are quite different animals with the Q60 more the size of the Highlander/Grand Cherokee?

I have had the Highlander for three years and it has been problem free. Its not an exciting car to drive like the BMW X5, but its useful.

We had a Sequoia in Utah and it was a beast, we traded it in for an Outback which is fun to drive.
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
Interesting that you call it too big. I was very worried about that so I looked up the specs when I started shopping and it was only 6 inches longer than our current Jeep Grand Cherokee. When I did my test drive it didn't feel too big.

Im resigned to something bigger but didn't want to go the Escalade or QX80 route. That's too big for me. At least we aren't getting a minivan.

I do have some sticker shock. Im not a big car person. As long as it gets me from point A to point B and has AC Im good so I keep my cars a long time. I'm 41, have owned a car since I was 16 and have only had 3 cars. When I bought my last one in 2008 it was right after everything had crashed and I got a loaded Jeep Grand Cherokee for $20K. I haven't had a car payment for 4 years. Not looking forward to that again.

Then maybe you should be heading for an MDX. The car is a bit more expensive than some of its competitors, but you get your money back over the long haul. We had a 2002 MDX that went for over 300K with little repair issues until I hit a deer one night. The result was a draw - i.e. neither the car nor the deer survived the impact.
quote:
Originally posted by Rob_Sutherland:
I’m getting ready to be in the market for a second car and am actually at a bit of a loss as to what to get.

We have a MB ML350 diesel which handles the majority of our family driving. We need something though that can fit our 7 and 3 year olds along with their car/booster seats but for cross town trips not hours long trips. Also has to be useable during the winter (but that’s a low bar, outside of snow days I’d daily drive a Ferrari if I had a chance). So it doesn’t need to be exceptionally practicable and I prefer rare/unique/interesting (though not something that is going to make my mechanic happier than me). Really its main use would be something nice for my wife and I to drive in to work together with every day, for those other times when it’s just my wife and I going somewhere and have the ability to pick up or drop off the boys when two cars are needed.

Would prefer used (love someone else’s depreciation) but would prefer being able to lease/finance. Budget is about $40-60k. I”ve been thinking hard about a 911, maybe a BMW 6 series Grande Coupe, a smaller battery Tesla S…

What else should I be looking at?


Maserati Wink
quote:
Originally posted by vinoevelo:
quote:
Originally posted by Rob_Sutherland:
I’m getting ready to be in the market for a second car and am actually at a bit of a loss as to what to get.

We have a MB ML350 diesel which handles the majority of our family driving. We need something though that can fit our 7 and 3 year olds along with their car/booster seats but for cross town trips not hours long trips. Also has to be useable during the winter (but that’s a low bar, outside of snow days I’d daily drive a Ferrari if I had a chance). So it doesn’t need to be exceptionally practicable and I prefer rare/unique/interesting (though not something that is going to make my mechanic happier than me). Really its main use would be something nice for my wife and I to drive in to work together with every day, for those other times when it’s just my wife and I going somewhere and have the ability to pick up or drop off the boys when two cars are needed.

Would prefer used (love someone else’s depreciation) but would prefer being able to lease/finance. Budget is about $40-60k. I”ve been thinking hard about a 911, maybe a BMW 6 series Grande Coupe, a smaller battery Tesla S…

What else should I be looking at?


Maserati Wink


Can we get Mangiare to get one too and all go in procession?

And I knew you would say that by the way. Wonder why?? Razz
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
Looking at the Infiniti QX60. Anyone have one?


Full disclosure, I work for Nissan/Infiniti. Drove the QX60 as my demo for 6 months and I really liked it, but it was too big for my needs, so I'm not sure I'd get another. I also drove a Pathfinder for 6 months and at the top trim for each vehicle, there is no meaningful difference between the two IMO, so I'm not sure I'd pay the premium for the Infiniti. If you can wait for a bit and don't need something so big, the 2019 QX50, which should be available this summer, is a gorgeous vehicle and something I'd buy in a heartbeat over the QX60.

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