tokaji maturation

Is this a real post?

In terms of overall vintage, 1993 was a great vintage but it was fairly early after the collapse of the communist empire so the wineries weren't necessarily equipped to deal with their bounty. That's why you find that Pajzos all the time - they bought whatever they could from other growers.

The designations of Aszu Eszencia and Eszencia Natur are BS that came about as a result of the communist degradation of the wine. Eventually an "authority" like the WA or WS will do an article, but there is no one writing for either who really knows much about these wines. Kramer tasted some recently and I imagine that will result in an article one day, but his tastings are infrequent and he's not really intimately familiar with the wines.

All of the wineries you list are decent, the Szepsy and Oremus probably the best with the others in a second tier. But all of them should last quite a number of years - they're carefully made wines. And you're talking about 5 or 6P. You should have no problem keeping them as long as you'd keep a good Sauternes or TBA.

The higher sugar levels don't make the wines better or more age-worthy. You can keep any of those wines for a great many years if you like them older rather than younger.

That's a matter of personal taste. I drink a number of old wines but I'm not sure I like sweet wines with a number of years on them. I like the fresh flavors played against the tart fruit. In your case, your wines are only 10 years old, and having had a few of them recently, they're still quite fine w little sign of age. If they're amber-colored, you may have cork issues. Mine are quite clear still. Royal Tokaji is a slightly older style, so those may be darker.

Thanks for your great response GregT. I'm still pretty new to this, so whatever made you think it wasn't a real post please chalk up to my inexperience.

You say, "The designations of Aszu Eszencia and Eszencia Natur are BS that came about as a result of the communist degradation of the wine." I have read that the aszu eszencia designation is soon to be subsumed within 6 putts. category, leaving just eszencia, and broadening the 6 putt. category in terms of quality and residual sugar contents. My understanding of labeling to date is that eszencia natur (or just "eszencia") refers to the slightly fermented, undiluted free run of juice from vats of aszu berries, whereas aszu eszencia is made by adding aszu berry dough (and eszencia) to a base wine - but in much greater quantities than for a typical 6 puttonyos. The putt. rating system is based on threshold values for residual sugar content, but in practice the thresholds are often breached and r.s.c. gives no absolute indication of experienced sweetness anyway. Plus there is a huge range of allowable r.s.c in Eszencia itself. Have I understood the BS element correctly... and can you elaborate further?

All the aszu essencia I've seen from 1993 looks a fairly dark amber now. But the very dark 1993 Disznoko a.e. I have still still tastes fairly fruity, and is delicious. The fruit might be slightly singed (caramelized more than burnt), but the insides are ripe and fresh, and everything is in glorious balance. By contrast, I had a challenging, maple syrup-hued 1993 Disnoko 6 putts recently and while still enjoyably sweet, there was a biting sourness there too and it finished a tad bitterly. I think that had more to do with intrinsic excess acidity than age or oxidation. But all my more recent 5 & 6 putts & a.e. from Oremus, Szepsy and RTC are still very light in color.

Only reason I thought it may not be real is that you happened to have some good stuff and most people wouldn't have known to buy those.

But it's true what you state about the essencia or eszencia or however we're spelling it these days! What happened was that people wanted 6P so the communists just said sure, here's some 6P and then the producers needed another category to cover what should REALLY have been 6P so they came up with the name of aszu-essencia. Now that the communists are gone, the wines don't need to be called anything else.

The natur is in fact the run-off, which is why there's a range of sugar levels. It's really only bottled for the people who don't know the wines and have only read about them.

Wine drinkers who don't know imagine that if 5 is good, 6 is better and anything higher is better yet. None of that is actually true and the essencia-natur is essentially undrinkable, much as honey or maple syrup would be undrinkable. A spoonful suffices. Because there's no base wine, there's no acidity to cut through the painful sweetness. You have it once, satisfy your curiosity, and don't bother with it any more.

The designation "puttonyos" comes from the wooden pail that used to be used to collect the berries. At 6P, you had almost a 1:1 ratio of aszu paste to wine so more wouldn't really accomplish all that much. That's also the reason there's a range of sugar levels - if you're mixing based on quantity of raisins, your sugar extract will depend on the sugar in the grapes. Mine may be higher or lower than yours and they'll also vary by year.

Today they do it based on sugar measurements, which I suppose is more accurate albeit less romantic. Nonetheless, there's a wide range and my 5P may be your 6P. In all cases, the critical balance is between the acidity and the sugar.

If your wines are still light-colored, you're in fine shape. They should last for a very long time and they're certainly the equal of many, if not most, Sauternes. People don't talk about them all that often on these boards, instead they talk about various Sauternes, but keep in mind that the marketing and hype machines haven't been working for these wines since 1945 like they have for the others.

I have a bunch of wines from Szepsy that have been in someone's basement in Budapest for a few years now and I'm really nervous about them. Those that I have at home here are fine but they're in cool cellars. At least I'll be able to do a test of wines kept at 55F and the same wines kept at 65F! Cheers.

i 've heard from a hungarian friend that the country's largest sugar refinery is also located a stones throw away from many of the country's wineries.

As you're driving up the highway, it's on the right. And it's not a joking matter. The communists had a cruel, if unintended, sense of irony. Just like they'd build a hotel next to a metal-stamping factory, they put a sugar refinery right outside Tokaj. First time I went there I couldn't believe it. Or actually, I could, because I'd just spent the prior night in that hotel!

puts a new meaning to the word "chaptalization"

xerula,

Here are some links to my posts on my visits to a few Hungarian wineries. I think they include some drinking windows and comments from Istvan Szepsy and another winemaker:

Istvan Szepsy visit

Uri Borok visit

VM

Vino - nice posts but a bit out of date tho. Today the winemaker at Kiralyudvar is Demeter Zoltan, not Szepsy, who hasn't been there for a few years now. They're both acquaintances/friends and they're both good winemakers but Szepsy was never the full time winemaker. BTW - the pronunciation is Sep-She. The Sz is closer to our "S" and the S closer to our "Sh".

quote:

Originally posted by xerula:

Recently I've become very interested in Tokaji aszu.

quote:

But I'm still not terribly confident when it comes t o predicting future trajectories of flavor and drinkability. In fact apart from a few Sauternes I've dabbled in, the whole concept of laying down whites is still a bit alien to me. I know the top Eszencias are supposed to age for all eternity, but I've read conflicting guidance on lesser mixtures. Any advice on the drinking windows for the following vintages would be much appreciated, as well as general pointers:

quote:

Disznoko
Aszu Eszencia 1993 (CT says drink now-2030, wine-searcher now-2018)
6 puttonyos 2000

great wine, was one of the first "less-oxidised-made" aszus after the communism.

was always good, doesn't get better with years. meaning it dos not change to get better, so my drinking advise would be:
drink now, enjoy as long as you have.

that doesn't been it won't get older!
it will become riper for many decades.

quote:

Royal Tokaji Co.
5 puttonyos, 2001, 2006, 2007
6 puttonyos Nyulaszo 1999, 2003

since i never had a royal tokaji that i really liked, i did not taste all of you're list.
meening: i can't be a help here.

quote:

Szepsy Estate
5 puttonyos 2005

had this from barrel, clean! strayed, sweet as many 6p. but still not as big as his 6p's.
fresh apricot, and some vegetable notes behind, hint of spices like macis.

don't know if the bottles have changed, since my last visit 2007
i don't have any of this in my cellar.

quote:

Oremus
6 puttonyos 2002

Oremus could have all it needs to bring out the best - but they don't do.
always clean, very good wines, but lacking in depth.
drink now - i don't believe it will gain with age


cheers!

was goign to say, I miss those port notes tsunami!