board-o posted:
bman posted:
arsenal4ever posted:

I hope Omar and Tlaib aren't the face of the new progressive Democratic party, as both appear to be anti-Semitic, and they've only been in office since January.

They apologized in what seemed like a sincere manner.

Sincere? There must be too many heavy metals in them Canadian water. Omar did NOT apologize. She made an excuse. No sane person thinks that was a sincere apology.

Marc, I though your passive/aggressive and other personal attacks against me ended when you unfriended and blocked me on Facebook for deleting your racist posts on my wall.  How about we keep it that way, OK?

California here I GO - 

"A growing number of Californians are contemplating moving from the state — and not due to wildfires or earthquakes but the sky-high cost of living, according to a survey released Wednesday.

The online survey, conducted last month by Edelman Intelligence, found sentiment of leaving the nation's most populous state highest among millennials.

Fifty-three percent of Californians surveyed are considering fleeing, representing a jump over the 49 percent polled a year ago."

Please don't come to Arizona...I like it fine the way it is now

arsenal4ever posted:

I'm just tired of politicians and celebrities shooting their mouth off and then apologizing in a "sincere manner." Anti-Semitism and racism go hand-in-hand. Apologizing does nothing. 

So once you’ve said something racist, in your mind they are racist for ever ?

mimik posted:

So once you’ve said something racist, in your mind they are racist for ever ?

There was an interesting opinion piece in the Globe yesterday about why we tend to label people based on a single act committed sometimes decades ago.  Apparently we do it to mentally separate 'us' as normal people from "them' as deviants.  By labeling, we never have to strive to understand them as people, or try to make sense of the reasons they may have 'trangressed' in the first place. 

mimik posted:
arsenal4ever posted:

I'm just tired of politicians and celebrities shooting their mouth off and then apologizing in a "sincere manner." Anti-Semitism and racism go hand-in-hand. Apologizing does nothing. 

So once you’ve said something racist, in your mind they are racist for ever ?

An interesting question, in a sense like can a person evolve or are they static in their beliefs?  Social surroundings in early life certainly have an impact on one's cultural beliefs, which can be positive or negative.  I believe that one can grow and change one's views based upon continuing education and experience.  That someone once held racist views, does not necessarily mean that they will always have racist views or be a racist.

I also believe that we as a society, having been influenced by identity politics, tend to oversimplify events and see things in black and white, when there are shades of gray.  Too many issues or events are viewed from a prism of being racist or xenophobic without sufficient evidence.  It is much easier to claim racism than to try to understand the issue more and to discuss an issue with someone who has a different point of view. 

thistlintom posted:
mimik posted:
arsenal4ever posted:

I'm just tired of politicians and celebrities shooting their mouth off and then apologizing in a "sincere manner." Anti-Semitism and racism go hand-in-hand. Apologizing does nothing. 

So once you’ve said something racist, in your mind they are racist for ever ?

An interesting question, in a sense like can a person evolve or are they static in their beliefs?  Social surroundings in early life certainly have an impact on one's cultural beliefs, which can be positive or negative.  I believe that one can grow and change one's views based upon continuing education and experience.  That someone once held racist views, does not necessarily mean that they will always have racist views or be a racist.

I also believe that we as a society, having been influenced by identity politics, tend to oversimplify events and see things in black and white, when there are shades of gray.  Too many issues or events are viewed from a prism of being racist or xenophobic without sufficient evidence.  It is much easier to claim racism than to try to understand the issue more and to discuss an issue with someone who has a different point of view. 

contrary to popular belief, humans as a whole are born with implied bias.  It's what keeps you from walking into a lions den thinking they won't eat you.  Society then will subtly (forcibly) reinforce those implied biases throughout life.  Right or wrong, it's simply human nature to group, sort, organize, categorize things in a particular way and our standard schooling reinforces that.

I, do feel that a certain pro israel contingent is being entirely disingenuous in calling everybody else in the world "anti semitic" / racist exactly to your last point thislintom.  There is an irony in a group of people calling everyone else "anti semites" because it already implies that they feel their own race is superior and that everyone else is just hating on them. 

People may not change being racist, but experience, knowledge and communication can/should lead to better empathy. 

On another level, this forced Political correctness is certainly going overboard.  Forcing people without teaching someone why they should is just a recipe for disaster. 

flwino posted:

Can't believe that a paper in Alabama, suggested that the KKK March against the democrats & suggested that they bring noses to DC.   What in the H$%^ is this clown thinking

As someone who grew up in Alabama, I can attest he is simply voicing the racist backward opinion shared by many there (and elsewhere), who now feel enabled to say what they want out loud - when in the past (post-civil rights era anyway) they would not have dared.  

g-man posted:
thistlintom posted:
mimik posted:
arsenal4ever posted:

I'm just tired of politicians and celebrities shooting their mouth off and then apologizing in a "sincere manner." Anti-Semitism and racism go hand-in-hand. Apologizing does nothing. 

So once you’ve said something racist, in your mind they are racist for ever ?

An interesting question, in a sense like can a person evolve or are they static in their beliefs?  Social surroundings in early life certainly have an impact on one's cultural beliefs, which can be positive or negative.  I believe that one can grow and change one's views based upon continuing education and experience.  That someone once held racist views, does not necessarily mean that they will always have racist views or be a racist.

I also believe that we as a society, having been influenced by identity politics, tend to oversimplify events and see things in black and white, when there are shades of gray.  Too many issues or events are viewed from a prism of being racist or xenophobic without sufficient evidence.  It is much easier to claim racism than to try to understand the issue more and to discuss an issue with someone who has a different point of view. 

contrary to popular belief, humans as a whole are born with implied bias.  It's what keeps you from walking into a lions den thinking they won't eat you.  Society then will subtly (forcibly) reinforce those implied biases throughout life.  Right or wrong, it's simply human nature to group, sort, organize, categorize things in a particular way and our standard schooling reinforces that.

I, do feel that a certain pro israel contingent is being entirely disingenuous in calling everybody else in the world "anti semitic" / racist exactly to your last point thislintom.  There is an irony in a group of people calling everyone else "anti semites" because it already implies that they feel their own race is superior and that everyone else is just hating on them. 

People may not change being racist, but experience, knowledge and communication can/should lead to better empathy. 

On another level, this forced Political correctness is certainly going overboard.  Forcing people without teaching someone why they should is just a recipe for disaster. 

Don't want to get in a big debate about Israel and its backers - and many are unable to accept legitimate criticism of its government and policies - but unfortunately,  the root of much of the historical criticism of Israel is based on anti-semitism which provides a historical basis for its supporters to believe that all criticism is founded on anti-semitism - it provides a sort of "cover" if you will.  

g-man posted:
thistlintom posted:
mimik posted:
arsenal4ever posted:

I'm just tired of politicians and celebrities shooting their mouth off and then apologizing in a "sincere manner." Anti-Semitism and racism go hand-in-hand. Apologizing does nothing. 

So once you’ve said something racist, in your mind they are racist for ever ?

An interesting question, in a sense like can a person evolve or are they static in their beliefs?  Social surroundings in early life certainly have an impact on one's cultural beliefs, which can be positive or negative.  I believe that one can grow and change one's views based upon continuing education and experience.  That someone once held racist views, does not necessarily mean that they will always have racist views or be a racist.

I also believe that we as a society, having been influenced by identity politics, tend to oversimplify events and see things in black and white, when there are shades of gray.  Too many issues or events are viewed from a prism of being racist or xenophobic without sufficient evidence.  It is much easier to claim racism than to try to understand the issue more and to discuss an issue with someone who has a different point of view. 

contrary to popular belief, humans as a whole are born with implied bias.  It's what keeps you from walking into a lions den thinking they won't eat you.  Society then will subtly (forcibly) reinforce those implied biases throughout life.  Right or wrong, it's simply human nature to group, sort, organize, categorize things in a particular way and our standard schooling reinforces that.

I, do feel that a certain pro israel contingent is being entirely disingenuous in calling everybody else in the world "anti semitic" / racist exactly to your last point thislintom.  There is an irony in a group of people calling everyone else "anti semites" because it already implies that they feel their own race is superior and that everyone else is just hating on them. 

People may not change being racist, but experience, knowledge and communication can/should lead to better empathy. 

On another level, this forced Political correctness is certainly going overboard.  Forcing people without teaching someone why they should is just a recipe for disaster. 

I wouldn't say people are born with biases, but they are born with instincts that are products of evolution.  For example, a person may react to a perceived threat in a way that is an instinct towards preservation.  In a book by Jonathon Haidt called the Righteous Mind, he talks about morality and how people react to events and make judgements about the events.  An event might make a person make a decision about the morality involved in the event.  That person will look at things that will likely support his initial view on the issue, rather than look at all the facts and then adjust his decision.  This implied bias can result in people seeing something and coming up with different opinions of an event, such as the Covington kids confrontation.  What becomes important is that there is interaction between those with different views to discuss and come up with a more appropriate determinations of what happened.  Unfortunately, we as a society have become more tribal and there is not as much give and take between the different tribes, so there is not as much determination of the "truth" in society.  Haidt is concerned with academia in that the universities have become increasingly more liberal and do not have enough conservatives to provide a counter perspective to biases by liberals. (Haidt is actually leans left and is a classic liberal, so this is not a conservative venting).

Certain groups can have strong biases, especially if they are not open to hearing other viewpoints and adjusting their opinions.  They may not even understand the strength of their biases because they only hear an echo chamber with discussions within their own "tribe".  I think this is one reason why you can have anti-semitic or racial biases in a group.  

 

bman posted:

This discussion is getting pretty deep. When can we go back to random and off-topic comments, and picking on Trump and those who love him?   Where are Mimik, w + a and PH when you need them? 

I’ve long suspected Bruins fans of being against deep thought. 

billhike posted:
bman posted:

This discussion is getting pretty deep. When can we go back to random and off-topic comments, and picking on Trump and those who love him?   Where are Mimik, w + a and PH when you need them? 

I’ve long suspected Bruins fans of being against deep thought. 

bman posted:
billhike posted:
bman posted:

This discussion is getting pretty deep. When can we go back to random and off-topic comments, and picking on Trump and those who love him?   Where are Mimik, w + a and PH when you need them? 

I’ve long suspected Bruins fans of being against deep thought. 

You mean USC? 

thistlintom posted:
jcocktosten posted:
g-man posted:

Strangely enough my nike sneakers exploded too

Nike Quality Control - oxymoron

So if Zion blew out his knee due to the shoe blowout, is Nike liable?

Potentially.  Not my area of practice but if the shoe was not altered/messed with, it was defective and would not satisfy the implied warranty of merchantability that it be reasonably free from defect

bman posted:

This discussion is getting pretty deep. When can we go back to random and off-topic comments, and picking on Trump and those who love him?   Where are Mimik, w + a and PH when you need them? 

Happy to comply!  Still happy with Trump and current state of affairs.  No mention of the Smolett case here yet?  Sad.  I never heard of him before this...yet Van Jones says he is the Jackie Robinson of the day...oh God, that is a giant overstatement.  Good for the Chicago PD...they really shone brightly this week...especially today.

I had never heard of Smollet either. Anyone who thought a point was made when the initial reports came out is nuts. Anyone who thinks a point is made now is equally so. Hate crimes (and likewise sex crimes) are real. Hate crimes are on the rise, though there is some dispute over by how much, given that some of the increase in reported numbers is due to an increase in reporting and agencies whose reports are factored in. About 93% of police reports filed of violent crimes (including hate crimes and sex crimes) are made in good faith and all plausible police reports of violence should be taken seriously and investigated fully. The end. 

winetarelli posted:

I had never heard of Smollet either. Anyone who thought a point was made when the initial reports came out is nuts. Anyone who thinks a point is made now is equally so. Hate crimes (and likewise sex crimes) are real. Hate crimes are on the rise, though there is some dispute over by how much, given that some of the increase in reported numbers is due to an increase in reporting and agencies whose reports are factored in. About 93% of police reports filed of violent crimes (including hate crimes and sex crimes) are made in good faith and all plausible police reports of violence should be taken seriously and investigated fully. The end. 

listening to the DA statement yesterday.  They nailed everything that happened with phone calls, Uber rides, cameras very well.   Also the jerk signed the $3,500 check with his own name!

What concerns me is the way the MSM has jumped on stories without doing any research or further investigation and condemned those supposedly that did wrong, especially when instances occur that seem to support their biased views.  This has recently happened with the Covington kids and Jussie Smollett.  True journalism is suffering.

thistlintom posted:

What concerns me is the way the MSM has jumped on stories without doing any research or further investigation and condemned those supposedly that did wrong, especially when instances occur that seem to support their biased views.  This has recently happened with the Covington kids and Jussie Smollett.  True journalism is suffering.

For quite a while, it seems as if it doesn't matter who gets it right or wrong, but who gets the story out first.  And then the apology is buried after the fact.

As far as the Covington kids go, do you have a link to what they (MSM) wrong?  After hearing and watching all of the videos, still looked like a bunch of racist, misogynistic spoiled punks to me

napacat posted:
bman posted:

This discussion is getting pretty deep. When can we go back to random and off-topic comments, and picking on Trump and those who love him?   Where are Mimik, w + a and PH when you need them? 

Happy to comply!  Still happy with Trump and current state of affairs.  No mention of the Smolett case here yet?  Sad.  I never heard of him before this...yet Van Jones says he is the Jackie Robinson of the day...oh God, that is a giant overstatement.  Good for the Chicago PD...they really shone brightly this week...especially today.

Smolett?  you mean the guy who faked an emergency because he couldn't get enough money for something?

Wait.. that sounds oddly familiar.

You know who else we didnt talk about?  Christopher Paul Hasson.

"Hasson also expressed admiration for Russia. "Looking to Russia with hopeful eyes or any land that despises the west's liberalism," he wrote in the draft email. Prosecutors say during the past two years he had regularly searched online for pro-Russian as well as neo-Nazi literature."

What happened napacat?  how come you didnt talk about him?  Selective vision?  Sad.

patespo1 posted:
thistlintom posted:

What concerns me is the way the MSM has jumped on stories without doing any research or further investigation and condemned those supposedly that did wrong, especially when instances occur that seem to support their biased views.  This has recently happened with the Covington kids and Jussie Smollett.  True journalism is suffering.

For quite a while, it seems as if it doesn't matter who gets it right or wrong, but who gets the story out first.  And then the apology is buried after the fact.

As far as the Covington kids go, do you have a link to what they (MSM) wrong?  After hearing and watching all of the videos, still looked like a bunch of racist, misogynistic spoiled punks to me

yea, I'm curious to see if any new video came to light that showed these kids to be such glorious saints preaching the gospel and words of love and showing the entire world how we should have proper intelligent conversations with people we don't agree with.

Everything that has been shown has looked more like something out of Golding instead.

The original news was that the students, including Nicholas Sandmann, confronted and accosted  Nathan Phillips by swarming him and threatening him in a physical manner and blocking him and refusing to allow him to retreat. 

Video showed that prior to the interaction with Phillips, the kids were taunted by a group of black preachers using homophobic slurs.  The kids sat down and did some school chants to try to avoid the situation.  Nathan Phillips went up to the group of kids banging on his drum and chanting.  They did not confront Phillips

There is a big disparity between what was initially reported by news (and along with that the condemnation and attacks on the kids, including death threats), and what actually happened.

thistlintom posted:

The original news was that the students, including Nicholas Sandmann, confronted and accosted  Nathan Phillips by swarming him and threatening him in a physical manner and blocking him and refusing to allow him to retreat. 

Video showed that prior to the interaction with Phillips, the kids were taunted by a group of black preachers using homophobic slurs.  The kids sat down and did some school chants to try to avoid the situation.  Nathan Phillips went up to the group of kids banging on his drum and chanting.  They did not confront Phillips

There is a big disparity between what was initially reported by news (and along with that the condemnation and attacks on the kids, including death threats), and what actually happened.

This is largely true. I don’t think much of those kids for various reasons, including some caught on tape, but “prove they’re angels” is rediculous. They shouldn’t need to. They’re kids. And initial reports painted them in a far worse light than their verifiable actions deserve. The real problem, though, is our national obsession with minutiae and anecdote; rather than collection of large amounts of data and evidence relating to pressing issues of the day, and dispassionate and logical analysis of said evidence and data. 

g-man posted:
napacat posted:
bman posted:

This discussion is getting pretty deep. When can we go back to random and off-topic comments, and picking on Trump and those who love him?   Where are Mimik, w + a and PH when you need them? 

Happy to comply!  Still happy with Trump and current state of affairs.  No mention of the Smolett case here yet?  Sad.  I never heard of him before this...yet Van Jones says he is the Jackie Robinson of the day...oh God, that is a giant overstatement.  Good for the Chicago PD...they really shone brightly this week...especially today.

Smolett?  you mean the guy who faked an emergency because he couldn't get enough money for something?

Wait.. that sounds oddly familiar.

You know who else we didnt talk about?  Christopher Paul Hasson.

"Hasson also expressed admiration for Russia. "Looking to Russia with hopeful eyes or any land that despises the west's liberalism," he wrote in the draft email. Prosecutors say during the past two years he had regularly searched online for pro-Russian as well as neo-Nazi literature."

What happened napacat?  how come you didnt talk about him?  Selective vision?  Sad.

Gman,


Happy to talk about that nut job Hasson.  And the strongest possible action should be taken that the law allows.  Not a problem with a life sentence.  Same for the Alabama ISIS wife who wants to return...no way should she come back to the U.S.  

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