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Preferred Attire For A Nice Night Out?

M mrcabernetMember
quote:
Originally posted by wine+art:
quote:
Originally posted by Dom'n'Vin'sDad:
Let's just say it has taken me quite a few years to make "that much" money. And I am still vastly underpaid! Wink


ALL teachers are underpaid!!! Frown

Not in CA they aren't. They are the second highest paid teachers in the US. If they gave up 20% of their salaries they would still be the second highest paid teachers in the US. And the benefits and retirement package most of us can only dream about.
T tpewinedrinkerMember
quote:
Originally posted by Adam10:
Teachers who are passionate about it or always wanted to teach are good, but there are loads here who 'fell back' on it, and expect the world. Most I know are muppets, but there are some excellent credits as well...

I disagree... Teachers are slightly above sanitation workers in terms of appreciation. Most that I know have done it because they have a love for it. I have yet to meet one that "expects the world." Maybe I have been lucky. Instead of being critical of their benefit and retirement packages, I think there need to be better student loan forgiveness programs, higher pay, and more job security to ensure that the next generation of students has access to a great education provided by great teachers.
M mrcabernetMember
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
quote:
Originally posted by Adam10:
Teachers who are passionate about it or always wanted to teach are good, but there are loads here who 'fell back' on it, and expect the world. Most I know are muppets, but there are some excellent credits as well...

I disagree... Teachers are slightly above sanitation workers in terms of appreciation. Most that I know have done it because they have a love for it. I have yet to meet one that "expects the world." Maybe I have been lucky. Instead of being critical of their benefit and retirement packages, I think there need to be better student loan forgiveness programs, higher pay, and more job security to ensure that the next generation of students has access to a great education provided by great teachers.

Again second highest paid teachers in the US yet our state's school results have dropped from the top to lower 25% in 15 years. Perhaps throwing more money and benefits isn't the answer. Also, how about a system where underperformers can be fired like in the private sector? Teachers know who the bad apples are and yet they help keep in place, through their unions, a system where they are protected.
T tpewinedrinkerMember
quote:
Originally posted by Mr Cabernet:
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
quote:
Originally posted by Adam10:
Teachers who are passionate about it or always wanted to teach are good, but there are loads here who 'fell back' on it, and expect the world. Most I know are muppets, but there are some excellent credits as well...

I disagree... Teachers are slightly above sanitation workers in terms of appreciation. Most that I know have done it because they have a love for it. I have yet to meet one that "expects the world." Maybe I have been lucky. Instead of being critical of their benefit and retirement packages, I think there need to be better student loan forgiveness programs, higher pay, and more job security to ensure that the next generation of students has access to a great education provided by great teachers.

Again second highest paid teachers in the US yet our state's school results have dropped from the top to lower 25% in 15 years. Perhaps throwing more money and benefits isn't the answer. Also, how about a system where underperformers can be fired like in the private sector? Teachers know who the bad apples are and yet they help keep in place, through their unions, a system where they are protected.

Of course we should have the second-highest paid teachers... The cost of living is substantially more than Wyoming! And a system where the under performers are fired??? Hell, we live in a state where the OVERperformers are still fired because CA is on the verge of fiscal Armageddon. The teachers' union is getting murdered at the expense of a lot of other unions. I would gladly trade a cop for an additional teacher.
M mrcabernetMember
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
The teachers' union is getting murdered at the expense of a lot of other unions. I would gladly trade a cop for an additional teacher.

I like this, one state worker's union blaming another state worker's union. And we're expected to pay higher taxes to keep all of them in the lifestyle they've grown accustomed to.
T thereweresevenineightMember
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
Dressing up for dinner is all well and good but I hardly think it says what kind of person you are. Take someone like myself. I have worn a uniform for over a decade. I only have two suits, one tux and dont invest in clothes at all. I have no need to. I prefer to spend my money on important things like wine. Wink I live in Florida. I wear flip flops EVERYWHERE unless I am in my suit. I wear shorts and flip flops to nice restaraunts in the off season and jeans and flip flops in season.

I dont feel I am disrespecting my fellow diners. I look nice but am never the best dressed in the place. The thing is, I just dont care what other diners think. I am not trying to be too cool here but I dont care. I am not a lawyer of businessman trying to close deals. I am not trying to impress anyone. I'm just there for a nice relaxing dinner. Wearing a coat, tie and closed toes shoes isnt relaxing to me.
"changes in latitudes changes in attitudes"...I'm with you jb. Cool
T tpewinedrinkerMember
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
I would gladly trade a cop for an additional teacher.


Until you need one.

I needed one when I got car-jacked and had my face smashed in with the butt of a gun. Nowhere to be found... But they were there when I was going 33 in a 25 at 3 am. I am not critiquing the work that police officers do. They have a very demanding job and I would not trade shoes with them for a second. I have always supported them through donations. But the truth is, some of the most dangerous places right now are schools! Teachers face a lot of the same risks that officers now face. Yet police districts keep hiring more officers while schools keep cutting more teachers. There is a fundamental disconnect there because there is evidence that shows that badly-performing school districts are more likely to have increased crime rates.... So what do we do? If we invest more in schools, we might not have to invest so much in police. Anyways, this thread has gotten terribly off-topic and I apologize for that. I am more than happy to discuss fashion all day however.
A adam10Member
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
"Maybe I have been lucky.


We'll have to agree here. Like I said, I know some great ones, but the majority are as I said. Bear in mind, we're talking about different countries. But I've gone through 3 teacher strikes cos they had to have an extra few kids in the classroom or stay behind an extra half hour, etc. They boycotted our extra curricular, so sports were on hold for a year and a bit. Bloody joke. Think the board gave two sh*ts? Hard to sympathise with them when you are raised by those who don't get summers off and aren't home at 3pm. A kid on my team is a teacher, and he's always taking the p*ss at how good he has it.
purplehazepurplehazeMember
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
But the truth is, some of the most dangerous places right now are schools! Teachers face a lot of the same risks that officers now face. Yet police districts keep hiring more officers while schools keep cutting more teachers.


The solution to dangerous schools has nothing to do with the number of teachers or the number of police officers. It has to do with parents. Or the lack thereof.

PH
J jburman82Member
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
I would gladly trade a cop for an additional teacher.


Until you need one.

I needed one when I got car-jacked and had my face smashed in with the butt of a gun. Nowhere to be found... But they were there when I was going 33 in a 25 at 3 am. I am not critiquing the work that police officers do. They have a very demanding job and I would not trade shoes with them for a second. I have always supported them through donations. But the truth is, some of the most dangerous places right now are schools! Teachers face a lot of the same risks that officers now face. Yet police districts keep hiring more officers while schools keep cutting more teachers. There is a fundamental disconnect there because there is evidence that shows that badly-performing school districts are more likely to have increased crime rates.... So what do we do? If we invest more in schools, we might not have to invest so much in police. Anyways, this thread has gotten terribly off-topic and I apologize for that. I am more than happy to discuss fashion all day however.


Im sory that happened to you but I would bet they responded as quickly as they could and tried like hell to catch the people who did it.

AS for schools being dangerous. I agree. Its a shame that in south Florida our shool police officers, they ones who work in the schools all school day, are being cut. Right along with the teachers. I dont know of a single county or city in the area that is actively hiring officers. Some get hired to replace the ones retiring but its not a one for one swap.

Trust me, cops are feeling the budget crunch just like everyone else.

Are poor school districts in higher crime area's because of the uneducated kids or because they are usually in areas with more poverty?
M mrcabernetMember
quote:
Originally posted by Chilicat:
I just want to be the first one to say something along the lines of, "If you can afford all this fancy wine and clothing you can afford more taxes to pay teachers and cops!"

I just wanted to see what it would be like to be that guy. Wink

This is a fallacious argument. First, in my own case, I'm not buying bespoked (glad I got to use that word again) clothes. As for wine, which I consider a normal accompaniment to food, I've reduced to buying $10 bottles as Costco. Now let's say I'm one of those people on this board buying cars with tires that get 10,000 miles, drinking wines older than me, and traveling the world--so what? Why does that mean they have to pay state union workers more money if they don't deserve it? Perhaps these people already contribute to charities or run businesses that employ dozens or even hundreds of people. People who then pay taxes to help support the state union worker. (Whose money then goes to the unions whose money is then used to give campaign money to politicians who will do whatever their union bosses demand, at least in CA's broke political system.)
C chilicatMember
quote:
Originally posted by PD2K:
quote:
Originally posted by Chilicat:
I just want to be the first one to say something along the lines of, "If you can afford all this fancy wine and clothing you can afford more taxes to pay teachers and cops!"

I just wanted to see what it would be like to be that guy. Wink


You're joking, right?


Completely.
C chilicatMember
quote:
Originally posted by Red guy in a blue state:
Back on track with a question:

I have been invited to an event where the attire is "casual cocktail." What the hell is that? I am familiar with "Casual" and "Cocktail" attire. So what constiutes casual cocktail? Jacket and tie with no pants?


I think half the time people specify attire they really either do not know exactly what they want or exactly what they are saying.
S snipesMember
quote:
Originally posted by Red guy in a blue state:
Back on track with a question:

I have been invited to an event where the attire is "casual cocktail." What the hell is that? I am familiar with "Casual" and "Cocktail" attire. So what constiutes casual cocktail? Jacket and tie with no pants?


BBQ wear. Hawaiian shirt and visor.
T thirstymanMember
quote:
Teachers know who the bad apples are and yet they help keep in place, through their unions, a system where they are protected


wrong.

administrators keep them in place by not fully documenting their deficiencies and moving them through the discipline process. I have heard administrators say numerous times that it is easier to get a bad teacher transfered than it is to get a bad teacher fired, so they are transfered (generally with good teacher reviews from the same admins that wanted them gone).

Personally, I do not believe 60 grand plus benefits a year is some kind of unearned handout and that teachers are living in the lap of luxury. To even get to that level of pay, most teachers have to have advanced degrees (Master's or PhDs) and many years of experience.

back on topic - are cowboy boots acceptable at fine dining?

G
M mrcabernetMember
quote:
Originally posted by thirsty man:
quote:
Teachers know who the bad apples are and yet they help keep in place, through their unions, a system where they are protected


wrong.

administrators keep them in place by not fully documenting their deficiencies and moving them through the discipline process. I have heard administrators say numerous times that it is easier to get a bad teacher transfered than it is to get a bad teacher fired,...

Isn't that because of the tenure rules that the union fought for and will not wavier on?

quote:
Personally, I do not believe 60 grand plus benefits a year is some kind of unearned handout and that teachers are living in the lap of luxury.

Never said it was an "unearned handout."

quote:
back on topic - are cowboy boots acceptable at fine dining?

No. But don't tell my in-laws. They are hardcore Native American collectors and are covered in bolos, turquoise, leather vests and ruffled shirts. When it comes to Native American art I often can't tell the difference between kitsch and quality.
T thirstymanMember
quote:
Isn't that because of the tenure rules that the union fought for and will not wavier on?


No, all tenure does is require the admins to document why the teacher deserves to be fired. All of the animosity should be directed at lazy admins that don't bother to properly paper the file with why the teacher is bad and why the teacher should be terminated. All it takes is a modicum of effort.

G
M mrcabernetMember
quote:
Originally posted by thirsty man:
quote:
Isn't that because of the tenure rules that the union fought for and will not wavier on?


No, all tenure does is require the admins to document why the teacher deserves to be fired. All of the animosity should be directed at lazy admins that don't bother to properly paper the file with why the teacher is bad and why the teacher should be terminated. All it takes is a modicum of effort.
G

I think you'd better check what goes on in the most populous state in the Union. It's not so easy here.

I always wear a sport coat with a nice shirt or a knitted collarless shirt when going out for a nice evening.
T tdubMember
quote:
Originally posted by wine+art:
quote:
Originally posted by thirsty man:


Personally, I do not believe 60 grand plus benefits a year is some kind of unearned handout and that teachers are living in the lap of luxury.

Not even debatable.

back on topic - are cowboy boots acceptable at fine dining?

G


NEVER!


Ya know WA & ThirstyMan I really respect your statements on teachers. They truly are underpaid for what they do.

Being married to a dedicated 8th grade teacher with her Masters I can attest to the fact that she earns every dollar she makes.

To those that think she is overpaid and has bankers hours. Her CONTRACT hours are 8-3 but I can assure you that there are many nights every week that she doesn't walk out of there until after 5, some of those nights she comes home after that and grades papers and/or makes a lesson plan for the following day. So to those that think teachers are overpaid and underworked just remember that when your sitting at home enjoying your family and drinking a nice bottle of wine that many of the teachers of this country are at home worrying more about your kids than you do.

Her "Vacation" as most would call it is an absolute necessity, without teachers getting a "vacation" they would all be stark raving mad. My wife currently has a classroom with 38... yes I said 38 13-14 year old boys in it. That is enough to make anyone crazy.

Now I'm not saying there aren't bad teachers out there. But is that no different than any business out there? Private or Public sector every company big and small has it's strong and weak parts. I can say without a doubt that we should pay teachers more and hopefully more good teachers will come of it such as my wife and they will be able to get rid of those that don't belong which I truly believe would happen if they were paid what they deserved.

As far as getting rid of these bad apples, easier said than done, unfortunately there just aren't enough good teachers out there that truly care hence if we paid them what they deserved there might be more of them and less of the bad apples.

I'll stop rambling but until you truly know, love or have been a teacher I don't think anyone is qualified to discuss the topic most of which being politicians.
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