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Preferred Attire For A Nice Night Out?

C chilicatMember
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
quote:
Originally posted by Chilicat:
So, if what you are wearing shows neither respect nor disrespect...baseball hat inside a funeral home? Inside church? To the comfort argument, well, what if you are only comfortable nude? Shirtless? Just unwashed and dirty clothes?



I am simply talking about dining out. For weddings, funerals and church I have to much self respect to show up looking like a bum to someone else's special event.

I dont think we all have a right to wear whatever we want. However, I do think there is more than one way to skin a cat and there is more than one look that is presentable when dining out at a nice place.


How do you know that nice dinner isn't someone else's special event? They might be of modest means and have saved all year for their anniversary dinner at that place. The fact what you wear at a wedding or funeral is about your self respect, and not that of the newlyweds or dead person, is consistent with what both of us have been saying: for the majority it is about them and not about those around them.

I agree, there are multiple ways to skin a cat and more than one way to look presentable. This however does not mean I do not think there are certain boundary social expectations. Mine is that at a nice place I will not have to look at man-feet. Wink
T tdubMember
quote:
Originally posted by thirsty man:
I have purposefully stayed out of this discussion for the last bit - specifically since TDub and I spent a beers worth of time discussing whether it should be illegal to ride your bike naked.....

I am not a fan of having to wear a suit. That said, I sometimes wear a suit because I want to get dressed up - i just don't like "having" to dress up. I will ditch the tie for any reason at any time. I rarely wear one with friends (weddings and funerals excepted).

At a fine dining establishment, the most casual I will go is dress shoes, dark dressy jeans, button down shirt and a jacket. Many times I will switch the jeans for slacks. I will only wear a suit if I am coming from Court or another matter that already had me in a suit (unless it is supposed to be romantic for my wife - then, I'll wear whatever she wants - which is generally a suit).

I will say I am more inclined to wear a suit now than I was 10 years ago. I believe the main factor is that I started to have my suits made for me, instead of buying off the rack. Now that they "fit" properly (and are made out of better material), I am more comfortable and inclined to wear one more often. If you wear suits and have never had one tailor made for yourself, you should try it.

For some reason, I never did get into the shoes. For me, the main concern is comfort, followed by looks. I guess that is an outgrowth of having a horrible knee and back problems.

to continue my rambling - I do not care how my friends dress when we are out. I am just happy to be with them. I hate being late, however, since I was married and we had our first child, "we" have never been on time. Alone, "I" am rarely late. People on cell phones in fine dining establishments drive me crazy. If you have to take a call (and it does happen), then step outside.

G


I'll start that topic. Is it ok to ride your bicycle naked in a metropolitan area? I say no! lol. Really wish I didn't have to catch the bart as that beer was really tasty once we eventually found a place to have one!

And ps. I was wearing dark jeans and a very nice tshirt at dinner so neener neener.
J jburman82Member
Chilicat, of course its about them and not those around them. When I go over to my friend's house who graduated from UF for the FSU/UF game I dont wear orange and blue to make him happy. Hell, I might body paint myself garnet and gold just to make him uncomfortable. Should I poll my neighbors before I paint my house to make sure they all like the new color?

I am not into cars either. If I wanted a BMW or Lexus I could get one. However, I am almost 35 and am only on my third car, a 2008 Jeep Grand Cherokee. Should I not drive it to nice dinners since most of the parking lot is filled with Mercedes and BMW's?

I care what I look like. I just have a different opinion of what "presetnable" is.

Chilicat, if you dont like looking at man feet I recommend never dining in florida in the summer. Razz

EDIT: I will be the first one to admit that what I wear down here in Fla doesnt fly in places like NY and I would have to adjust my opinion of presentable.
Last edited by jburman82
C chilicatMember
Agreed, NYC is more formal than Florida. Tucson, where I live now, is far less formal than many places. As I said, location and season are factors. Even to the best place in Tucson I am not wearing a jacket when it's 119 degrees. It's also not expected. However, it's also not expected I show up in flip flops. Maybe that is exceptable where you live.

Okay, a more important question: pocketsquares. If you have a jacket on you are incomplete without one.
T thistlintomMember
I can understand Jburman's love for flip flops. I taught sailing for a summer in Dallas and I didn't wear anything else (hardly). But if someone took me out to a nice place to eat, I would at least put on Topsiders (very comfortable). JB-- how about nice sandals at least rather than flip flops? Smile In the tropics, sandals will get you into most anywhere.

It would really take something special for me to wear a suit, I rarely wear one at work, times have changed....though in Dallas it might not have yet Wink

Houston summer time - nice shorts, polo shirt almost anywhere...slacks and nice shirt at nicer places like Pappas Steakhouse.... mexican food - shorts and t-shirt and flip flops..
N nolaneMember
Those who have met me can attest to the fact that I dress very casually, getting me to wear a button up shirt is rare, and I own no slacks. I am, however, rather picky with jeans and shoes. Once the sun goes down, and often when the sun is up, I think it's unacceptable to wear flip flops to a sit-down, table service restaurant and shorts are unacceptable in the evening (unless you are a frequent Chili's customer).
J jburman82Member
quote:
Originally posted by ThistlinTom:
JB-- how about nice sandals at least rather than flip flops? Smile In the tropics, sandals will get you into most anywhere.



Flip flops is just my generic term. I have spent upwards of $75 on "nice sandals". I have a couple of pairs that I wear. Its not just one pair that goes everywhere.

I also include closed toe open back shoes in the term flip flops. I have a lovely pair of white ones I bought for a 70's themed birthday party but liked so much they have entered my regular rotation.
W wine+artMember
quote:
Originally posted by ThistlinTom:
I can understand Jburman's love for flip flops. I taught sailing for a summer in Dallas and I didn't wear anything else (hardly). But if someone took me out to a nice place to eat, I would at least put on Topsiders (very comfortable). JB-- how about nice sandals at least rather than flip flops? Smile In the tropics, sandals will get you into most anywhere.

It would really take something special for me to wear a suit, I rarely wear one at work, times have changed....though in Dallas it might not have yet Wink

Houston summer time - nice shorts, polo shirt almost anywhere...slacks and nice shirt at nicer places like Pappas Steakhouse.... mexican food - shorts and t-shirt and flip flops..


TT, if Jack tried to darken the door at Pappas Steakhouse in shorts and open toe shoes, he would never get past the valet, nor should he!
W wine+artMember
quote:
Originally posted by NolanE:
Those who have met me can attest to the fact that I dress very casually, getting me to wear a button up shirt is rare, and I own no slacks. I am, however, rather picky with jeans and shoes. Once the sun goes down, and often when the sun is up, I think it's unacceptable to wear flip flops to a sit-down, table service restaurant and shorts are unacceptable in the evening (unless you are a frequent Chili's customer).


First, Nolan is a friend and a great guy, but that said, a slave to fashion he is NOT! Big Grin

This said, at least he understands footwear. Wink
winedocwinedocMember
quote:
Originally posted by wine+art:
quote:
Originally posted by ThistlinTom:
I can understand Jburman's love for flip flops. I taught sailing for a summer in Dallas and I didn't wear anything else (hardly). But if someone took me out to a nice place to eat, I would at least put on Topsiders (very comfortable). JB-- how about nice sandals at least rather than flip flops? Smile In the tropics, sandals will get you into most anywhere.

It would really take something special for me to wear a suit, I rarely wear one at work, times have changed....though in Dallas it might not have yet Wink

Houston summer time - nice shorts, polo shirt almost anywhere...slacks and nice shirt at nicer places like Pappas Steakhouse.... mexican food - shorts and t-shirt and flip flops..


TT, if Jack tried to darken the door at Pappas Steakhouse in shorts and open toe shoes, he would never get past the valet, nor should he!


Houston may be more casual than Dallas, but I have never seen someone wear a pair of shorts at the restaurants that I have frequented, particularly Pappas Steakhouse or Vic and Anthony's. Some interesting regional differences here. Smile
W wine+artMember
quote:
Originally posted by Wine doc:
quote:
Originally posted by wine+art:
quote:
Originally posted by ThistlinTom:
I can understand Jburman's love for flip flops. I taught sailing for a summer in Dallas and I didn't wear anything else (hardly). But if someone took me out to a nice place to eat, I would at least put on Topsiders (very comfortable). JB-- how about nice sandals at least rather than flip flops? Smile In the tropics, sandals will get you into most anywhere.

It would really take something special for me to wear a suit, I rarely wear one at work, times have changed....though in Dallas it might not have yet Wink

Houston summer time - nice shorts, polo shirt almost anywhere...slacks and nice shirt at nicer places like Pappas Steakhouse.... mexican food - shorts and t-shirt and flip flops..


TT, if Jack tried to darken the door at Pappas Steakhouse in shorts and open toe shoes, he would never get past the valet, nor should he!


Houston may be more casual than Dallas, but I have never seen someone wear a pair of shorts at the restaurants that I have frequented, particularly Pappas Steakhouse or Vic and Anthony's. Some interesting regional differences here. Smile


Completely agree! That is what I said to Jack. He would never get past the valet in such attire, much less the front door. Smile

Completely and totally unacceptable, if not rude.
J jburman82Member
quote:
Originally posted by wine+art:
quote:
Originally posted by ThistlinTom:
I can understand Jburman's love for flip flops. I taught sailing for a summer in Dallas and I didn't wear anything else (hardly). But if someone took me out to a nice place to eat, I would at least put on Topsiders (very comfortable). JB-- how about nice sandals at least rather than flip flops? Smile In the tropics, sandals will get you into most anywhere.

It would really take something special for me to wear a suit, I rarely wear one at work, times have changed....though in Dallas it might not have yet Wink

Houston summer time - nice shorts, polo shirt almost anywhere...slacks and nice shirt at nicer places like Pappas Steakhouse.... mexican food - shorts and t-shirt and flip flops..


TT, if Jack tried to darken the door at Pappas Steakhouse in shorts and open toe shoes, he would never get past the valet, nor should he!


First of all, I brighten doors. Razz

Down here our nice places like Ruth Chris, Morton's, III Forks and Capital Grille shorts and flip flops are welcome year round. They are also ok off season in Palm Beach. Different styles for different parts of the country.
G g-manMember
quote:
Originally posted by NolanE:
Those who have met me can attest to the fact that I dress very casually, getting me to wear a button up shirt is rare, and I own no slacks. I am, however, rather picky with jeans and shoes. Once the sun goes down, and often when the sun is up, I think it's unacceptable to wear flip flops to a sit-down, table service restaurant and shorts are unacceptable in the evening (unless you are a frequent Chili's customer).


werne't you dressed when we hit up that italian place?
G g-manMember
quote:
Originally posted by Board-O:
Times have changed. Many years ago, maybe 30, my wife and I went to Sparks in NYC. I was wearing a sport jacket and nice slacks but with no tie. I was stopped at the door and they lent me a tie to wear during dinner.


i'll attest that sparks doesn't let me in with shorts and a tshirt (last year)

The palm west side where I frequent very often tho, lets me get away with alot.
C chilicatMember
quote:
Originally posted by KSC02:
quote:
Originally posted by Chilicat:
pocketsquares. If you have a jacket on you are incomplete without one.

You just lost me, Chilicat. Eek
May I respectfully ask your age? This may influence my reaction Smile


Early 40s. A nice pocket square just sets off your outfit like nothing else. You can give it a try for very little money. Head into your local J. Banks or Men's Warehouse. PLEASE BUY NOTHING ELSE ( Smile ) but a box of three, prefolded, white linen pocket squares. Try wearing one a few times and see if you do not garner quite a bit of attention from the ladies over it.

I am enheartened by the agreement I have received here.
Last edited by chilicat
C chilicatMember
quote:
Originally posted by CSM:
quote:
Originally posted by Adam10:
I've never had to buy a bespoke suit, unless you count the odd small "take in" of an inch.


No one "has" to buy a bespoke suit. It is, however, something to which every man should treat himself.


Completely agree.

Also, I think what he was trying to say is he's fit and/or trim so off the rack fits him just fine vs. fat guys. While I will agree an off the rack will tend to fit a trim person better than a hefty one to say they necessarily fit well is just untrue. Arm holes, shoulders, drop...all are very variable and everyone can benefit from having these made per person. Now, I certainly do not have a closet full of bespoke, but I also have my off the rack stuff worked on a little more than just a small "take in." Zegna shirts fit me almost perfectly but I need the shoulders slightly raised for me and the sleeves taken up about 1/4" as an example. If you have an athletic build (a drop of 10" or more) you can almost always benefit from good tailoring.

Lastly, there is customization. Like peak lapels? A ticket pocket? Pick stitching? Maybe an extra pocket for a dedicated purpose inside your jacket? This is where bespoke shines too.
T thirstymanMember
Well - for me, I started having to have suits tailored because I was a 50 coat and a 36 waist pants. The pants that come with a 50 coat are 46 inch waist. Plus, a 50 coat fit my shoulders, but I could hide a case of wine in the belly area. If you are having an off the rack suit "tweaked" less than a .5 inch or maybe an inch, then it is probably fine. For me, they were taking in 10 inches on the waist (now closer to 6 but that is a different story) and another 6-8 inches in the belly of the suit coat. Clothes just don't look proportional when they have that much "work done". Same as people I guess....

G
S seaquamMember
quote:
Originally posted by Chilicat:
quote:
Originally posted by CSM:


No one "has" to buy a bespoke suit. It is, however, something to which every man should treat himself.


Completely agree.



Lastly, there is customization. Like peak lapels? A ticket pocket? Pick stitching? Maybe an extra pocket for a dedicated purpose inside your jacket? This is where bespoke shines too.



I've never really been much aware of fashion, but my darling wife has never given up on me. She tries to dress me well, and therefore I have some very nice clothes that I don't wear very often.

When I lost a lot of weight last fall, she insisted that I should have a bespoke suit. I resisted, but she finally took me into a tailor. It was an interesting interview; my wife answered most of the questions. I ended up with a pair of suits, exactly the type of material I like (I prefer lighter weight, no matter what season), and in the style of Zegna (as Chillicat wrote, they can make any style you like). They are comfortable and quite obviously custom fitted. They actually cost a bit less than buying a Zegna suit, and I now look forward to occasions when I can wear them. Sometimes I'll wear just the jackets with either slacks or jeans. I seldom wear a tie, unless absolutely necessary.

If any of you have any doubts about the advantage of a bespoke suit, you need to talk to my wife for a while. She'll set you straight.

That's how I found out that socks match the pants, not the shoes, unless they're sneakers and then all the rules change. Smile
T tpewinedrinkerMember
For me, I pretty much have to buy bespoke... Certain designers like Dries van Noten, Jil Sander, Bottega Veneta and sometimes YSL make a suit that very well fits the contours of my body. But most suits are simply too big. Fortunately, being in Taiwan has its advantages. There are such high import duties on imported luxury goods that an off-the-rack suit from Zegna can run about $3,000. However, I have an amazing tailor, who imports Zegna, Kiton and Loro Piana wools and cashmeres, and only has to pay the taxes on the fabric, which is substantially cheaper. A full bespoke suit made from Zegna cloth runs about $1500, the Kiton and Loro Piana cost about $3,000.
A adam10Member
quote:
Originally posted by Chilicat:
quote:
Originally posted by CSM:
quote:
Originally posted by Adam10:
I've never had to buy a bespoke suit, unless you count the odd small "take in" of an inch.


No one "has" to buy a bespoke suit. It is, however, something to which every man should treat himself.


Completely agree.

Also, I think what he was trying to say is he's fit and/or trim so off the rack fits him just fine vs. fat guys. While I will agree an off the rack will tend to fit a trim person better than a hefty one to say they necessarily fit well is just untrue. Arm holes, shoulders, drop...all are very variable and everyone can benefit from having these made per person. Now, I certainly do not have a closet full of bespoke, but I also have my off the rack stuff worked on a little more than just a small "take in." Zegna shirts fit me almost perfectly but I need the shoulders slightly raised for me and the sleeves taken up about 1/4" as an example. If you have an athletic build (a drop of 10" or more) you can almost always benefit from good tailoring.

Lastly, there is customization. Like peak lapels? A ticket pocket? Pick stitching? Maybe an extra pocket for a dedicated purpose inside your jacket? This is where bespoke shines too.


That's not exactly what I meant. I meant it really just seems to fit for some reason. Like average by the definition build perhaps? I guess technically I've had bespoke, but at Harry Rosen, they're tailoring for me but it ended up not being much. I figured most meant bespoke being completely custom.
C chilicatMember
quote:
Originally posted by Adam10:
quote:
Originally posted by Chilicat:
quote:
Originally posted by CSM:
quote:
Originally posted by Adam10:
I've never had to buy a bespoke suit, unless you count the odd small "take in" of an inch.


No one "has" to buy a bespoke suit. It is, however, something to which every man should treat himself.


Completely agree.

Also, I think what he was trying to say is he's fit and/or trim so off the rack fits him just fine vs. fat guys. While I will agree an off the rack will tend to fit a trim person better than a hefty one to say they necessarily fit well is just untrue. Arm holes, shoulders, drop...all are very variable and everyone can benefit from having these made per person. Now, I certainly do not have a closet full of bespoke, but I also have my off the rack stuff worked on a little more than just a small "take in." Zegna shirts fit me almost perfectly but I need the shoulders slightly raised for me and the sleeves taken up about 1/4" as an example. If you have an athletic build (a drop of 10" or more) you can almost always benefit from good tailoring.

Lastly, there is customization. Like peak lapels? A ticket pocket? Pick stitching? Maybe an extra pocket for a dedicated purpose inside your jacket? This is where bespoke shines too.


That's not exactly what I meant. I meant it really just seems to fit for some reason. Like average by the definition build perhaps? I guess technically I've had bespoke, but at Harry Rosen, they're tailoring for me but it ended up not being much. I figured most meant bespoke being completely custom.


Bespoke is completely custom. As I said earlier, it is above even made to measure, which takes your measurements but then sends it off to a remote location, usually Hong Kong, and you do not have multiple fittings. Most (60% or so) of my clothes are made to measure, I have some Zegna shirts which I really like, then several sportscoats and suits that are bespoke. Another great thing about this is that a classically cut suit of this quality lasts for many years and continues to look classic.
T tpewinedrinkerMember
Bespoke is definitely much more personalized. It will involve multiple fittings over an extended period. like an instrument, you are fine-tuning it over that period, so that every detail is to your specifications. Made-to-measure will consist of a one-time extensive measuring of your body and then you receive the suit; however, you don't get to provide feedback during the suit construction process. If you are very picky, bespoke involves much more creative control and is far more satisfying.
G g-manMember
quote:
Originally posted by T Dub:
quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
quote:
Originally posted by T Dub:
I'll start that topic. Is it ok to ride your bicycle naked in a metropolitan area? I say no!


Fashionable New yorkers disagree with you.

http://www.nydailynews.com/new...bed_in_times_sq.html

not that I trust nydaily news as my legal source but just saying.


Apparently the NY popo agrees with me though.


We all know that NYPD never randomly arrests individuals or even knowing the laws in nyc ;-)
A adam10Member
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
Bespoke is definitely much more personalized. It will involve multiple fittings over an extended period. like an instrument, you are fine-tuning it over that period, so that every detail is to your specifications. Made-to-measure will consist of a one-time extensive measuring of your body and then you receive the suit; however, you don't get to provide feedback during the suit construction process. If you are very picky, bespoke involves much more creative control and is far more satisfying.


That's how I always thought it as well. Almost had it done on Saville Row, but never bothered...well comfy already. Maybe if I'm bored simply based on your certainties.
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