Porsche:

Did he also tell you that you MUST get your oil changed at their service department? My Dad had one about 5 years ago. I dont remember anything like that. I'll ask him tomorrow to be sure though.

Jack, that does not bother me too much. She is on her 3rd MB, with an Audi thrown in as well. She has always worked with the dealerships.

The synthetic oil helps a lot.

the 10k sounds a bit unreasonable.

but i remember reading that any "n" rated tires would do for porsche

michelin has a bunch.

http://www.michelinman.com/tir...l=911&option=Carrera

alot of them are rated for 30k miles.

the carrera asks for 235/40 18 in
for the front
and 265/40 18 in for the back

which will cost 215$ * 2 for the front
and
266$ * 2 for the back.

and depending on how hard she peels the back wheel,

chances are you'll be replacing the back two before the front two.

so it'll be like 600$ each time.

You're going to buy a Porsche and you are worried about tires?

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:

quote:

Originally posted by ThistlinTom:
You're going to buy a Porsche and you are worried about tires?

Well, if the salesperson is correct, and you are going to spend $2400+ a year on tires alone when compared to other cars one is considering, sure.

Tipping points are just that, tipping points. Why do you think BMW offers such a strong maintenance program for no cost?

Most of the real high performance tires I've bought are good for close to 20,000 miles. 10 sounds like too little to me. Forget about driving with them on snow, even if you have 4 wheel drive. They're great on wet roads though.

I did not have that experience.
W+A, how many miles a year do you anticipate your wife putting on the car per year, and what is her driving style (aggressive, defensive)?
I do agree that if you are going to buy a Porsche, you should get Z-rated tires. Skimping out on tires is like using leaded gasoline for your high-performance engine - or, like drinking a '59 Calon-Segur out of a Dixie cup.
The back tires are far bigger (and more expensive) than the front tires. I ran over a nail with my back tire, and it cost $550 to replace at a discount tire place. But I did not find that all 4 wheels wear out at the same time. The back tires wear out first (it being a rear-wheeled vehicle). So it is very unlikely that you will have to replace all 4 tires every year. In my 2 years with my Porsche, I only had to change the one tire.
I drive with Z-rated tires on my MB now, and I am changing them for the first time after 17,000 miles.

quote:

Originally posted by Board-O:
Most of the real high performance tires I've bought are good for close to 20,000 miles. 10 sounds like too little to me. Forget about driving with them on snow, even if you have 4 wheel drive. They're great on wet roads though.

Agree entirely with Board-O's post. D won't be 'pushing' the car to its' limits I'm quite sure. She should get closer to 20k as posted above.

On that note (regarding using only Dealership service):
Also, while under warranty, I was using the Dealership for my maintenance. I just had my "B Service" message come on. I inquired with my dealership how much that would be. $625 before tax (which =$700 here).

I took my car over to a very clean, professional, local shop that D has been using for a couple of years to quote me the same service. He's taken care of a few small items for me and always has been very honest with me (admittedly, I even slanted my approach to offer him the opportunity to gouge me. He didn't bite). Same full "B" service cost me $225.

Now I'm sure the MB Dealer hires first rate guys and they're not cheap but, in my book, so is this guy (at 70% less). I checked his work. Spot on.

All that said, I see D in an SLK

Just sayin'

quote:

Originally posted by KSC02:

I took my car over to a very clean, professional, local shop that D has been using for a couple of years to quote me the same service. He's taken care of a few small items for me and always has been very honest with me (admittedly, I even slanted my approach to offer him the opportunity to gouge me. He didn't bite). Same full "B" service cost me $225.

Now I'm sure the MB Dealer hires first rate guys and they're not cheap but, in my book, so is this guy (at 70% less). I checked his work. Spot on.

KSC,
With that said, by going "out of network", are you worried about voiding the warranty? Does your mechanic go through the same checklist and turn off all of the annoying warning service lights? What about the "free" loaner, or do you just wait for the service to be complete?
Where I live, I rely on the loaner so that I can get on with my day.

I have owned 2 porsches, 1 currently. Unless she is tracking the car, which I doubt, she should EASILY get 16,000 miles from the tires, even if she drives it aggressively. 20,000 is easily attainable. The $1200-$1400 is a pretty reasonable estimate on the cost IF doing all 4 tires at once (but if she is looking at a carrera or turbo she will be replacing the rears first), whether through the factory or at an independent tire shop. I wouldn't expect you to have to budget a penny over $750/yr on tires, if driving approx. 12,000 miles/yr. What kind is your wife looking at- my gf has really been wanting a panamera, and I have been giving it considerable thought, but have not pulled the trigger on adding another to the garage.

quote:

Originally posted by Wine doc:
KSC,
With that said, by going "out of network", are you worried about voiding the warranty? Does your mechanic go through the same checklist and turn off all of the annoying warning service lights? What about the "free" loaner, or do you just wait for the service to be complete?
Where I live, I rely on the loaner so that I can get on with my day.

WineDoc-
The warranty is not in jeopardy if ALL the items in the checklist are followed, and documented (I made sure they were). Synthetic oil, proper filter, etc must be used (I also have less than 10,000km left on my warranty so I'm just engaging this now anyway)

The annoying warning lights- These can be turned off by you. The dealer will not generally be willing to tell you how, but will offer to do for you for about $60. See youtube.

Loaner- The shop is a convenient 25 minute walk for me however I had another transportation option so this is not a personal issue. That said, my local MB dealer here in Montreal 'rented' me a car for the day at add'l cost. As I purchased my vehicle in the States and paid them $2500 to 'import' with MB (change instrument panel, reconfigure wiring harness for daytime lamps, etc) I did not purchase the vehicle "from them" and thus was not qualified for a 'free' loaner.

quote:

Originally posted by KSC02:

quote:

Originally posted by Wine doc:
KSC,
With that said, by going "out of network", are you worried about voiding the warranty? Does your mechanic go through the same checklist and turn off all of the annoying warning service lights? What about the "free" loaner, or do you just wait for the service to be complete?
Where I live, I rely on the loaner so that I can get on with my day.

WineDoc-
The warranty is not in jeopardy if ALL the items in the checklist are followed, and documented (I made sure they were). Synthetic oil, proper filter, etc must be used (I also have less than 10,000km left on my warranty so I'm just engaging this now anyway)

The annoying warning lights- These can be turned off by you. The dealer will not generally be willing to tell you how, but will offer to do for you for about $60. See youtube.

Loaner- The shop is a convenient 25 minute walk for me however I had another transportation option so this is not a personal issue. That said, my local MB dealer here in Montreal 'rented' me a car for the day at add'l cost. As I purchased my vehicle in the States and paid them $2500 to 'import' with MB (change instrument panel, reconfigure wiring harness for daytime lamps, etc) I did not purchase the vehicle "from them" and thus was not qualified for a 'free' loaner.

Taiwan dealers pull this same crap. The high import taxes on foreign cars means that Carreras START at $210,000. As a foreigner, I am able to import one car every other year and skip the Taiwan duty. However, the dealerships simply refuse to service the car whatsoever, nor accept it for trade-in, so it is simply not worth the hassle.

I bought my MB used/pre-owned in Dallas, but my Houston dealership ponies up a free loaner with each service. Of course it is not exactly free with the high price for service, but I was feel satisfied with the red carpet treatment that I get at the local dealership. The same guy is always there waiting for me, we discuss the car together, and then he gets me a loaner. I am out of the dealership within 30 minutes.
Never got this kind of service at Audi, Porsche, or BMW.
Thanks for the info KSC.

w+a- my brother-in-law has been selling Porsche and Audi for quite some time. Whether it's new technology coming down the pipeline for a specific model, trends, concerns, etc...he is very much in the know with the details. If you wish, send me an email or FB and I would be happy to inquire with him on any questions you may have.

To MJ and all others, thanks.

I'm in agreement with the 20,000 mile thinking, also.

MJ, I will email/FB soon.

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:
Jack, that does not bother me too much. She is on her 3rd MB, with an Audi thrown in as well. She has always worked with the dealerships.

I must say this suprises me. There are few things I loathe more than going to a car dealership.

quote:

Originally posted by jburman82:

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:
Jack, that does not bother me too much. She is on her 3rd MB, with an Audi thrown in as well. She has always worked with the dealerships.

I must say this suprises me. There are few things I loathe more than going to a car dealership.

The MB dealership here gives fantastic service in every way, and make it so darn easy to work with. They pick up your car, leave a new loaner that makes you want a newer model ( ) and always return your car well groomed.

quote:

Originally posted by Board-O:
Most of the real high performance tires I've bought are good for close to 20,000 miles. 10 sounds like too little to me. Forget about driving with them on snow, even if you have 4 wheel drive. They're great on wet roads though.

Not much snow in Dallas, methinks. And, the roads aren't wet often either. The question is how long do the tires last driving on asphalt that is 125 degrees and melting.

Aren't you supposed to buy the wife a Mercedes and the girlfriend a Porsche?

quote:

Originally posted by irwin:
The question is how long do the tires last driving on asphalt that is 125 degrees and melting.

You talkin' to me?

quote:

Originally posted by KSC02:

quote:

Originally posted by Board-O:
Most of the real high performance tires I've bought are good for close to 20,000 miles. 10 sounds like too little to me. Forget about driving with them on snow, even if you have 4 wheel drive. They're great on wet roads though.

Agree entirely with Board-O's post. D won't be 'pushing' the car to its' limits I'm quite sure. She should get closer to 20k as posted above.

On that note (regarding using only Dealership service):
Also, while under warranty, I was using the Dealership for my maintenance. I just had my "B Service" message come on. I inquired with my dealership how much that would be. $625 before tax (which =$700 here).

I took my car over to a very clean, professional, local shop that D has been using for a couple of years to quote me the same service. He's taken care of a few small items for me and always has been very honest with me (admittedly, I even slanted my approach to offer him the opportunity to gouge me. He didn't bite). Same full "B" service cost me $225.

Now I'm sure the MB Dealer hires first rate guys and they're not cheap but, in my book, so is this guy (at 70% less). I checked his work. Spot on.

I agree with KSC completely. You would have to drag me into an MB dealer for service. They are certainly competent mechanics, but that's about all, who charge vastly inflated prices. That seems to work for people who want the 'service' and imagery that MB pretends to give you, but they really aren't good car people. You can get much better work done on your car and you don't have to get ripped for it.

quote:

Originally posted by Gigond Ass:
Aren't you supposed to buy the wife a Mercedes and the girlfriend a Porsche?

Um, my wife buys her own car. She can write a check, and with great ease I might add.

I only hope I remember to share this post with her moments before you finally meet her!

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:

quote:

Originally posted by Gigond Ass:
Aren't you supposed to buy the wife a Mercedes and the girlfriend a Porsche?

Um, my wife buys her own car. She can write a check, and with great ease I might add.

I only hope I remember to share this post with her moments before you finally meet her!

My wife is great at writing checks too...unfortunately, I'm the one that has to cover them.

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:

quote:

Originally posted by Gigond Ass:
Aren't you supposed to buy the wife a Mercedes and the girlfriend a Porsche?

Um, my wife buys her own car. She can write a check, and with great ease I might add.

I only hope I remember to share this post with her moments before you finally meet her!

Make sure you tell her it was a general question and not a specific one....

I just replaced mine and after much research bought Hankook Ventus v12's, these cost about 1/2 ($900) of the Michellin PS2's that are oem. My ps2's lasted 20k although they were suitably shot, but your definitely going to get more than 10k unless your wife is really pushing the car.

As far as service, yeah $200 oil changes suck, but if the car is not a long term keeper it may be worth it to let the dealer do it just for the time when you try and sell it. Some people may back away from DIY on a unwarranted car. I dont think serious service bill really kick in until about 40k anyway.

Late to the party! Agree with others that tires can be purchased anywhere. As far as mileage is concerned, I'm typically changing rubber at around 15K. As TPE mentioned, driving styles have an incredible effect on tire wear, especially soft rubber. I don't track my car, but I do drive it. If Mrs. w+a isn't an assertive driver there are tons of other vehicles with great attributes that will make her very happy. The things that make a Porsche truly special are found at the edge of the envelope.

TPE - I drove a Panamera for a while, and absolutely loved the car. I found it ugly (particularly the rear) but once inside found myself in a perpetual state of bliss. Again, if the GF isn't going to take advantage of the incredible power and handling of this beast, there are TONS of great, quick and sexy cars out there for tens of thousands less.

PH

quote:

Originally posted by PurpleHaze:
Late to the party! Agree with others that tires can be purchased anywhere. As far as mileage is concerned, I'm typically changing rubber at around 15K. As TPE mentioned, driving styles have an incredible effect on tire wear, especially soft rubber. I don't track my car, but I do drive it. If Mrs. w+a isn't an assertive driver there are tons of other vehicles with great attributes that will make her very happy. The things that make a Porsche truly special are found at the edge of the envelope.

TPE - I drove a Panamera for a while, and absolutely loved the car. I found it ugly (particularly the rear) but once inside found myself in a perpetual state of bliss. Again, if the GF isn't going to take advantage of the incredible power and handling of this beast, there are TONS of great, quick and sexy cars out there for tens of thousands less.

PH

Thanks so much for the feedback PH. Believe me, she will take full advantage of the speed and power- the girl is Steve McQueen behind the wheel. I, on the other hand, no longer even put the needle 1 mile above the limit due to some ridiculous bad luck (ticketed for going 33 in a 25 at 3am, and ticketed for driving on the shoulder for pulling over on the freeway to help someone change a flat). Couple those with one I did deserve (California stop), and my insurance premiums have really taken a hit this past 14 months after going 5 years without a ticket.

My gf, in contrast, can be doing a buck in a 65 and get off with a warning.... Girls get all the breaks.

quote:

Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
.....ridiculous bad luck (ticketed for going 33 in a 25 at 3am.....

I can assure you, you were not pulled over for speeding. At 3AM, if you were driving 33 in a 25, you were probably pulled over on suspicion of DUI. Too slow!!

PH

quote:

Originally posted by PurpleHaze:

quote:

Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
.....ridiculous bad luck (ticketed for going 33 in a 25 at 3am.....

I can assure you, you were not pulled over for speeding. At 3AM, if you were driving 33 in a 25, you were probably pulled over or suspicion of DUI. Too slow!!

PH

I know that is why he pulled me over, but once he tested me and I blew .000000, he didn't need to give me a ticket. The guy was just a total jerk.

quote:

Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:

quote:

Originally posted by PurpleHaze:

quote:

Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
.....ridiculous bad luck (ticketed for going 33 in a 25 at 3am.....

I can assure you, you were not pulled over for speeding. At 3AM, if you were driving 33 in a 25, you were probably pulled over or suspicion of DUI. Too slow!!

PH

I know that is why he pulled me over, but once he tested me and I blew .000000, he didn't need to give me a ticket. The guy was just a total jerk.

TPE, you are making me feel bad. I have gotten out of sooo many tickets, including once when clocked at 133.

This said, fret not, it REALLY pisses off several of my friends, and do not even get my wife talking about my luck.

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:

quote:

Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:

quote:

Originally posted by PurpleHaze:

quote:

Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
.....ridiculous bad luck (ticketed for going 33 in a 25 at 3am.....

I can assure you, you were not pulled over for speeding. At 3AM, if you were driving 33 in a 25, you were probably pulled over or suspicion of DUI. Too slow!!

PH

I know that is why he pulled me over, but once he tested me and I blew .000000, he didn't need to give me a ticket. The guy was just a total jerk.

TPE, you are making me feel bad. I have gotten out of sooo many tickets, including once when clocked at 133.

This said, fret not, it REALLY pisses off several of my friends, and do not even get my wife talking about my luck.

No need to feel bad at all... At an offline one of these days the young padawan will need to learn the tricks of the wise Jedi master.

quote:

Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
.....At an offline one of these days the young padawan will need to learn the tricks of the wise Jedi master.

Just don't get in a cab with him!!

PH

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:
I have gotten out of sooo many tickets, including once when clocked at 133.

One can only imagine how!

quote:

Originally posted by Board-O:

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:
I have gotten out of sooo many tickets, including once when clocked at 133.

One can only imagine how!

If replacement tire cost is a concern, why not put a clause in the purchase agreement that the dealer will include the first set of replacement tires, identical to factory originals, when they are required? You'll probably have to throw in a few more bucks, but only a fraction of what the tires would end up costing you later. Sales departments have some flexibility that service departments usually can't match.

That's a great idea, if it works. I'll try it. I'm due for a new car in a few months.

quote:

Originally posted by Seaquam:
If replacement tire cost is a concern, why not put a clause in the purchase agreement that the dealer will include the first set of replacement tires, identical to factory originals, when they are required? You'll probably have to throw in a few more bucks, but only a fraction of what the tires would end up costing you later. Sales departments have some flexibility that service departments usually can't match.

Not really, Seaq. Typically when a sales department is asked to "throw in" something of this value, it's set up in advance in an "equipment due account." The sales department is charged for the tires immediately, at whatever the dealer mandated markup from parts to sales is. The profit on the car deal is adjusted to account for the promised stuff. The normal markup on parts to a sales department (new or used) in a dealership is from 30-40% over dealer net cost. Tires, because they are SUCH a price sensitive item, are often sold at or near dealer net at most stores just to retain that portion of the service business and not have customers wandering over to the 3rd party repair shops. Short story, you CAN get a deal, and probably secure a set at or close to dealer cost, but there ain't no free lunch. Sales departments actually are a "profit center" to the parts and service departments at dealerships, so are give no special treatment. In fact at the better managed car stores, the sales departments actually pay the COD rate for labor in their own shops!!

PH

G-man nailed it. And Porsche or not, stealership usually markup tires just like high end restaurant mark up wines. As long as you go with N rated tires it should be fine. Personally I'd go with cheaper Z,W,Y rated tires which can handle the high speed already, but going with the N will means you won't get into any warranty or insurance issues should any unlikely event happens.

Also, 90% of the time the car salesman only knows the car on paper. They just pretend they know what they are talking about. Just call the services/parts department and ask to double check.

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:
I know we have a number of Porsche owners on this forum (PurpleHaze, Java, others) and other learned car people. (Shavez, KSC02, PH, others)

My wife is thinking about getting a new car. She drove a number of Porsche's yesterday. The salesperson told her she MUST only buy Porsche approved performance tires, and they would only last for 10,000 miles, max, and the replacement cost would be $1200 - $1400 each time.

Is this correct? I have two friends driving Porsche currently, and will inquire with them also.

TIA.

Guy is wacked out

You can run 'normal' tires if you are not racing etc.

Oil can go close to 10k


Have owned 5 chops, and never had a problem with this. I put the high performance on when onthe track, and then regular tires rest of time