to add to the thread.
I've tested about 10 recipes and also revised them as needed.
I'm hooked on this one for the time being. Keep in mind, I'm baking at 800C+. The combination of the 2 flours and olive oil give it the best chew/crispness combo imo. recipe
quote:Originally posted by mangiare:
to add to the thread.
I've tested about 10 recipes and also revised them as needed.
I'm hooked on this one for the time being. Keep in mind, I'm baking at 800C+. The combination of the 2 flours and olive oil give it the best chew/crispness combo imo. recipe
I'll put this one on deck for my next testing. Had great luck last time with Terroni's Tipo 0 (not double) pizza flour, Lahey's no-knead, 36 or so hours of room temp ferment (in bowl with plastic wrap...extra time wasn't intentional but worked really well), then portioned into 4 and only 4 pulls to form balls then into the fridge overnight. 2 or so hours covered at room temp to relax and I was able to stretch it almost paper thin.
OK so I have some more to add after a couple years. Recently I've used some commercial yeast. Had a lot of sourdough starters over the years and for some reason or another (moves mostly) I let them go so I decided to use some yeast I got at Safeway about five years ago. It's just fine. I have no idea how long it will be good, but apparently many years beyond the date stamped on the jar. Normally I let it proof a bit since it's old but I've kept it in the fridge and it works as well as ever.
You can save yourself a bit of trouble if you make a sponge first, so once the yeast is dissolved I add about 1/2 the flour and mix it up into a batter and let that bubble until roughly double in size, then add the rest of the flour and knead, etc. If you let it go too far it will become kind of sour and you'll lose some gluten due to overstretching, but it doesn't seem to be a great loss as you'll be adding fresh flour and the dough still stretches nicely.
And I found a beer shop, so I bought some barley malt and throw in a little bit of that hoping that it will improve the flavor.
As for the steel, I bought another little one and now I have a 3/4 piece of aluminum, a 1/4 steel, and a 1/8 steel stacked up. I don't think the aluminum matters but I don't have anywhere else to put it so they all stay in the oven.
I put them on the highest shelf right under the broiler and use the broiler only. If the broiler was down below, I'd put them there. Let them get really hot for about 30 minutes - it really matters! Not enough heat means that you won't get the right spring in your dough.
I've experimented with putting the steel on top of the stove and turning the burners on high. It works but it's pretty heavy and once it's hot moving it is an adventure in fine dining for sure.
Pure aluminum didn't work - there was almost no spring. The only thing I get out of it now is that it retains heat so I don't have to wait as long to make the second pizza. At least that's what I tell myself so I don't feel like I wasted forty bucks on a piece of metal with no purpose.
Anyway, I can get a pizza done in under 3 minutes. Sometimes I leave it a little longer to crisp it a little more but over 3 1/2 and it's burned. That's pretty close to a commercial oven.
As for the stretching of the flour - you want a high gluten flour. I have to walk back some of my comments about the flour since I've used 00 from a few sources (Caputo, Davino, etc.) Tipo 0 or 00 just refers to the grind, not the gluten. Because 00 is ground more finely than American flour, it burns more quickly. At least that's what I was told and whatever the reason, you definitely get more blackening than you will with another flour.
You want to knead the dough to develop the gluten. I've done the no-knead thing and it works, but it's nice to have a feel for how your dough is going to handle and the only way I know to do that is by handling it. No knead is always a surprise in that sense.
If your dough is too wet and it's no-knead, you may get tears. But if you have the right consistency, you can get it thin enough to see through - a windowpane effect. But stretch it slightly beyond what you want. Then let it contract. Lift it gently and let it contract naturally. It's like pie dough - if you stretch it to the max, when you try to bake it or move it, you're going to get serious shrinkage. So gently let it get into the size it wants to be.
I usually make it on the peel just because it's easier. I give it a few shakes before adding anything and it contracts a bit and slides off beautifully.
Best flour I've found so far is King Arthur's Artisan Bread. NOT their "pizza flour" which is actually a low-gluten pastry flour for some reason and totally pointless. You want a high-gluten flour. That KA is perhaps too high-gluten for some people but you can experiment.
The other experiment I've done is take some flour and whir it in the blender for a while to make it 00. I have no idea what the final size was - it's totally random, but it didn't hurt anything. Problem with Caputo and some of those is that they have little taste.
If you want a recipe, here's one from my favorite pizza place in San Diego (Solare):
2 2/3 c flour
196 ml water
1 tsp salt
It's pretty close to what you find all over. You can add another tsp salt and it will be better. I proof in the fridge. It's usually a three day project but if you're in a hurry, you can do it in a day. The only thing is that it's a LOT easier to work with the dough when it's cold. So my advice is that if you make it all in one day, before finally stretching it out, you put it in the freezer or fridge to cool. If you don't and if it's the right consistency, it will be so floppy it will stick and tear. Good luck everybody.
You can save yourself a bit of trouble if you make a sponge first, so once the yeast is dissolved I add about 1/2 the flour and mix it up into a batter and let that bubble until roughly double in size, then add the rest of the flour and knead, etc. If you let it go too far it will become kind of sour and you'll lose some gluten due to overstretching, but it doesn't seem to be a great loss as you'll be adding fresh flour and the dough still stretches nicely.
And I found a beer shop, so I bought some barley malt and throw in a little bit of that hoping that it will improve the flavor.
As for the steel, I bought another little one and now I have a 3/4 piece of aluminum, a 1/4 steel, and a 1/8 steel stacked up. I don't think the aluminum matters but I don't have anywhere else to put it so they all stay in the oven.
I put them on the highest shelf right under the broiler and use the broiler only. If the broiler was down below, I'd put them there. Let them get really hot for about 30 minutes - it really matters! Not enough heat means that you won't get the right spring in your dough.
I've experimented with putting the steel on top of the stove and turning the burners on high. It works but it's pretty heavy and once it's hot moving it is an adventure in fine dining for sure.
Pure aluminum didn't work - there was almost no spring. The only thing I get out of it now is that it retains heat so I don't have to wait as long to make the second pizza. At least that's what I tell myself so I don't feel like I wasted forty bucks on a piece of metal with no purpose.
Anyway, I can get a pizza done in under 3 minutes. Sometimes I leave it a little longer to crisp it a little more but over 3 1/2 and it's burned. That's pretty close to a commercial oven.
As for the stretching of the flour - you want a high gluten flour. I have to walk back some of my comments about the flour since I've used 00 from a few sources (Caputo, Davino, etc.) Tipo 0 or 00 just refers to the grind, not the gluten. Because 00 is ground more finely than American flour, it burns more quickly. At least that's what I was told and whatever the reason, you definitely get more blackening than you will with another flour.
You want to knead the dough to develop the gluten. I've done the no-knead thing and it works, but it's nice to have a feel for how your dough is going to handle and the only way I know to do that is by handling it. No knead is always a surprise in that sense.
If your dough is too wet and it's no-knead, you may get tears. But if you have the right consistency, you can get it thin enough to see through - a windowpane effect. But stretch it slightly beyond what you want. Then let it contract. Lift it gently and let it contract naturally. It's like pie dough - if you stretch it to the max, when you try to bake it or move it, you're going to get serious shrinkage. So gently let it get into the size it wants to be.
I usually make it on the peel just because it's easier. I give it a few shakes before adding anything and it contracts a bit and slides off beautifully.
Best flour I've found so far is King Arthur's Artisan Bread. NOT their "pizza flour" which is actually a low-gluten pastry flour for some reason and totally pointless. You want a high-gluten flour. That KA is perhaps too high-gluten for some people but you can experiment.
The other experiment I've done is take some flour and whir it in the blender for a while to make it 00. I have no idea what the final size was - it's totally random, but it didn't hurt anything. Problem with Caputo and some of those is that they have little taste.
If you want a recipe, here's one from my favorite pizza place in San Diego (Solare):
2 2/3 c flour
196 ml water
1 tsp salt
It's pretty close to what you find all over. You can add another tsp salt and it will be better. I proof in the fridge. It's usually a three day project but if you're in a hurry, you can do it in a day. The only thing is that it's a LOT easier to work with the dough when it's cold. So my advice is that if you make it all in one day, before finally stretching it out, you put it in the freezer or fridge to cool. If you don't and if it's the right consistency, it will be so floppy it will stick and tear. Good luck everybody.
I am going to borrow g-man's idea and just buy the dough from one of many pizza joints in my town.
quote:Originally posted by mangiare:
to add to the thread.
I've tested about 10 recipes and also revised them as needed.
I'm hooked on this one for the time being. Keep in mind, I'm baking at 800C+. The combination of the 2 flours and olive oil give it the best chew/crispness combo imo. recipe
Oh sure, I just get comfortable making my dough with 100% 00 flour and now you suggest blending it with all-purpose?
We use Wolfgang Puck's recipe for our cracker crust thin pizzas.
https://www.thespruce.com/wolf...-dough-recipe-101614
https://www.thespruce.com/wolf...-dough-recipe-101614
I listed about a year or so ago pictures of my wood fueled pizza oven. I've been playing with different crusts. I have one that I have modified a bit that seems to work well and has great flavor. I will sit down and transcribe my chicken scratch into a typed document if anyone is interested in it. It takes 24 to 36 hours to make. (lots of rest time)
I swear there was a pizza recipe thread someplace but I can't find it. Over the past year or so I have come up with some great ones. Every time we do a pizza night I try and add a new one to the mix. Some are total fails others are hits.
I swear there was a pizza recipe thread someplace but I can't find it. Over the past year or so I have come up with some great ones. Every time we do a pizza night I try and add a new one to the mix. Some are total fails others are hits.
quote:Originally posted by Kwbonez:
I listed about a year or so ago pictures of my wood fueled pizza oven. I've been playing with different crusts. I have one that I have modified a bit that seems to work well and has great flavor. I will sit down and transcribe my chicken scratch into a typed document if anyone is interested in it. It takes 24 to 36 hours to make. (lots of rest time)
I swear there was a pizza recipe thread someplace but I can't find it. Over the past year or so I have come up with some great ones. Every time we do a pizza night I try and add a new one to the mix. Some are total fails others are hits.
Would definitely be interested in seeing your recipe. I continue to tweak the various recipes I have used over the years. All turn out very good but I'm still missing the great hole structure that Machine talked about
quote:Originally posted by Parcival:quote:Originally posted by Kwbonez:
I listed about a year or so ago pictures of my wood fueled pizza oven. I've been playing with different crusts. I have one that I have modified a bit that seems to work well and has great flavor. I will sit down and transcribe my chicken scratch into a typed document if anyone is interested in it. It takes 24 to 36 hours to make. (lots of rest time)
I swear there was a pizza recipe thread someplace but I can't find it. Over the past year or so I have come up with some great ones. Every time we do a pizza night I try and add a new one to the mix. Some are total fails others are hits.
Would definitely be interested in seeing your recipe. I continue to tweak the various recipes I have used over the years. All turn out very good but I'm still missing the great hole structure that Machine talked about
The holes are tasty! But I'm still trying to get a dough like Libretto in town here...has a bit of soft sweet stretch to the bottom rather than a nice crisp. How are you cooking them P?? I'm still using my 1/2 inch steel under the broiler, usually takes about 100 seconds. I also have one of these https://www.amazon.ca/BakerSto...n-Box/dp/B00GJIEBDO, and I can fit it on the bbq and put the lid down enough that the dome heat is kept in there. Takes a bit more time to cook but turns out really good and doesn't smoke up my house like cooking on the steel under the broiler.
quote:Originally posted by mangiare:
to add to the thread.
I've tested about 10 recipes and also revised them as needed.
I'm hooked on this one for the time being. Keep in mind, I'm baking at 800C+. The combination of the 2 flours and olive oil give it the best chew/crispness combo imo. recipe
FWIW, this recipe worked out well in my 550F oven in stone mode (the oven, not me) on the steel.
quote:Originally posted by steve8:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by mangiare:
...in stone mode (the oven, not me) on the steel.
PH
Has anyone tried adding activated charcoal to their dough? No joke - the black stuff is made by burning birch, willow and other woods in the absence of oxygen It supposedly makes the crust easier to digest with less bloating if you're prone to that kind of thing and some even claim it reduces blood cholesterol.
Highly suspect health claims aside, I will say we've tried black crust pizzas from Masseria on King Street a couple of times and they were pretty good. We actually did a blind taste test against a white dough pie from the same place and could both pick out the charcoal-enhanced crust because it seemed lighter and more crisp.
Highly suspect health claims aside, I will say we've tried black crust pizzas from Masseria on King Street a couple of times and they were pretty good. We actually did a blind taste test against a white dough pie from the same place and could both pick out the charcoal-enhanced crust because it seemed lighter and more crisp.