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30 replies

Pie Crusts, necessary evil or perfect compliment?

F finzMember
Does a 'good' pie crust really add to a pie or is it something than can at best not get in the way of the delicious goodness on the inside?

I recently had an awesome piece of cherry pie recently when dining out. Cherry is my favorite along with crustless pumpkin pie covered in whipped cream. It had a dense filling that didn't flow like water all over the plate. They seem to follow my philosophy of minimizing the crust to let the filling shine. Unfortunately they only sell that pie for a few weeks of the year and are now featuring a different variety.

I didnt expect the one at the local Kowalski's to be quite as good, but it was like eating a toast sandwich the crust was so thick. I'm sure the crust was consider 'correct' since it was flaky, but it was just too thick. It seemed like it was half of each bite and 90% of the bites along the outer edges.

How do you like your pie crust? Does it change based on the pie?
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BRRBRRMember
I love good pie crust but, when it's bad, it can ruin the pie, no matter how perfect the filling. I don't necessarily agree that "flaky" is always better, as I've had some awesome less-flaky, more dough-like (not really doughy, but more moist and dense) crusts that were amazing. Often times, overly flaky crust recipes burn too easily, or dry out too readily. I think some butter is a must in pie crust, though purists often say shortening is the only way to go.

Consider me pro-crust.
robsutherlandrobsutherlandMember
Unless it is a truly wonderful crust (and I mean drop dead wonderful) the crust is usually a nuisance and distraction to the main event. Unless it’s a graham cracker (or something along those lines) crust. Then it’s all golden.

I have had some savoury, cheddar infused crusts that magnified the greatness of a good apple pie but looking back on most pies I remember great fillings and bad crusts for the most part. I don’t remember many so-so fillings and I don’t recollect many great crusts.
robsutherlandrobsutherlandMember
quote:
Originally posted by aphilla:
I wonder if someone did statistics whether there would be a divide in answering this question between people in the UK and in the US, and then between those in the US old enough to remember pie crusts being made with lard and those not.

I'd love to have a pie made the way my mom or aunts made them when I was growing up.


Lard, like duck fat, bacon fat and suet make most things better...
G gregtMember
Pro crust but there are 2 major things to keep in mind.

First, most people just don't make good crust. If they use crap like shortening, margarine, etc., the crust will be bad. You use butter. If you're interested, you can use duck fat. Bacon fat is too greasy and unless you like grease, which I don't, you shouldn't use it. You can get a better effect with smoked duck fat. Still, the key to butter is that there is a fat but also a water content and that matters.

Second, people don't pre-cook their crust. If you put a liquid or wet filling into raw pie crust and you bake that, the bottom crust will never really cook properly. It's why you get such bad pies when people do cherry, apple, pumpkin, etc. The problem with pre-cooking is that it makes it really hard to to a two-crust pie. So you use something else on top, or simply lay the crust on.

And then of course, you have to eat it fast.

Butter, flour, cold water and a bit of salt and it transforms into something great.
purplehazepurplehazeMember
Graham crackers are to pie crust as Taco Bell is to Mexican food. You can eat it, but it's not the real thing.... Razz

Seriously, if you're making a cheesecake or something similar, graham crackers are just great. If I'm making a real pie with homemade filling, there's nothing like a good flaky pie crust.

The problem with pie crust is that making it is not the easiest thing to do and store bought isn't even close. Sure, the ingredient list and process is fairly simple, but there is an "art" or a "feel" to when the dough is right. Making good pie crust in the summer (when most fruit pies are baked) is particularly difficult. The temperature and moisture content of the dough is very important and much harder to control when the kitchen is warm.

The drier the dough, the flakier and more tender the crust. Moister dough is MUCH easier to work with and easier to roll out. The problem is that moister dough tends to produce leathery, more doughy crusts.

The braintrust at Cooks Illustrated came up with an ingenious solution a few years back. Substitute a portion of the water called for in the recipe with vodka. Winner What happens is this:

You get a moist, malleable dough that is easy to work with and very easy to roll. Once the crust hits the oven, the vodka quickly evaporates, reducing the moisture content in the dough considerably.....leading to a more tender and flaky crust. Genius!! I've made a dozen or more pies, from fruit pies to quiches using this technique and have never had a dissapointment. My go-to, butt-simple pie crust recipe unless something better comes along.

I'm not home, but this recipe looks pretty close. I'd spend a year's online subscription to CI online for this recipe alone, if I knew how good it was.

You're welcome..... Banana

PH
V vinobevoMember
quote:
Originally posted by PurpleHaze:
Graham crackers are to pie crust as Taco Bell is to Mexican food. You can eat it, but it's not the real thing.... Razz

Seriously, if you're making a cheesecake or something similar, graham crackers are just great. If I'm making a real pie with homemade filling, there's nothing like a good flaky pie crust.

The problem with pie crust is that making it is not the easiest thing to do and store bought isn't even close. Sure, the ingredient list and process is fairly simple, but there is an "art" or a "feel" to when the dough is right. Making good pie crust in the summer (when most fruit pies are baked) is particularly difficult. The temperature and moisture content of the dough is very important and much harder to control when the kitchen is warm.

The drier the dough, the flakier and more tender the crust. Moister dough is MUCH easier to work with and easier to roll out. The problem is that moister dough tends to produce leathery, more doughy crusts.

The braintrust at Cooks Illustrated came up with an ingenious solution a few years back. Substitute a portion of the water called for in the recipe with vodka. Winner What happens is this:

You get a moist, malleable dough that is easy to work with and very easy to roll. Once the crust hits the oven, the vodka quickly evaporates, reducing the moisture content in the dough considerably.....leading to a more tender and flaky crust. Genius!! I've made a dozen or more pies, from fruit pies to quiches using this technique and have never had a dissapointment. My go-to, butt-simple pie crust recipe unless something better comes along.

I'm not home, but this recipe looks pretty close. I'd spend a year's online subscription to CI online for this recipe alone, if I knew how good it was.

You're welcome..... Banana

PH


Dude - you rock. Thanks for sharing!
mangiaremangiareMember
quote:
Originally posted by mangiare:
PH - just pulled a rhubarb pie out of the oven using this exact recipe. I cannot believe how this pie looks!
Judgeing by the wetness of the raw dough, I was expecting a disaster. Will report back tomorrow on the final outcome but looks fantastic.



Thank you PH -this is my go-to crust recipe going forward. Flakey, buttery in a good way, and just plain good. thanks for the tip. Vodka? who would have thought?
mangiaremangiareMember
quote:
Originally posted by Sharkey:
quote:
Originally posted by aphilla:
I'd love to have a pie made the way my mom or aunts made them when I was growing up.


+1 And, thankfully, I'm still able to get them. I have had the pleasure of eating at great restaurants all over the world and I have never had a Coconut Cream Pie as good as my Aunt's. Oh, the crust is a must!


If coconut cream pie is your thing and you are ever in Toronto, visit Scaramouche restaurant.
K ksc02Member
quote:
Originally posted by PurpleHaze:
Seriously, if you're making a cheesecake or something similar, graham crackers are just great. If I'm making a real pie with homemade filling, there's nothing like a good flaky pie crust.

The problem with pie crust is that making it is not the easiest thing to do and store bought isn't even close. Sure, the ingredient list and process is fairly simple, but there is an "art" or a "feel" to when the dough is right. Making good pie crust in the summer (when most fruit pies are baked) is particularly difficult. The temperature and moisture content of the dough is very important and much harder to control when the kitchen is warm.

The drier the dough, the flakier and more tender the crust. Moister dough is MUCH easier to work with and easier to roll out. The problem is that moister dough tends to produce leathery, more doughy crusts.

The braintrust at Cooks Illustrated came up with an ingenious solution a few years back. Substitute a portion of the water called for in the recipe with vodka. Winner What happens is this:

You get a moist, malleable dough that is easy to work with and very easy to roll. Once the crust hits the oven, the vodka quickly evaporates, reducing the moisture content in the dough considerably.....leading to a more tender and flaky crust. Genius!! I've made a dozen or more pies, from fruit pies to quiches using this technique and have never had a dissapointment. My go-to, butt-simple pie crust recipe unless something better comes along.

this recipe looks pretty close.

You're welcome..... Banana

PH

Used a similar equation (left out the shortening and it didn't need it) and used vodka in place of the water. Added a bit of chopped fresh parsely and thyme for a Chicken Pot Pie this weekend and it rocked! Thanks, PH Cool
purplehazepurplehazeMember
Dusted off a couple of holiday pie recipes to tweak for dinner at my cousins' with my Aunt and Uncle this year. I gotta say, this vodka recipe is a real nice arrow to have in the old quiver. Have I had better crusts? Maybe just a few times. Have I been able to produce more consistent, really good crust in all weather with less hassle? Nope. Even if you're a novice baker, give this a try. You'll be glad you did. Oh.....and do make sure the dough is really well chilled before rolling it out. It helps keep the very wet dough intact for putting in the pie pan.

PH

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