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NBA 2015-2016

W winespartyMember
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
you don't hear about it much, because it is RARELY done. people are still talking about Iverson stepping over Tyronn Lue damn near 15 years later... it is the ultimate form of disrespect.

Funny you mention the Iverson one...I saw ESPN had some throwback video of it on their site, and didn't remember it every happening. Probably because I watched very little of the NBA around that time. Kind of ironic that very shortly after that video was put on ESPN that Lue's team then gets involved with a similar situation.
J juicyMember
quote:
Originally posted by Jcocktosten:
Anyone who has played basketball or any sport competitively knows that LeBron's step over maneuver had nothing to do with getting back into the play -


In the NFL, standing over a downed opponent is considered taunting and a 15 yard penalty. Yes, this is the NBA but the intent to degrade your opponent is the same.
B bfwMember
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by winetarelli:
Where was THAT LeBron in most of this series? That is the LeBron that can win championships. He has to want it.

Agree!


It made a huge difference that Green was not out there defending.

Hopefully, Lebron and Kyrie can stay hot to force a game 7. Maybe Kevin Love will even show up in the next game!

As for the Warriors, Curry really has not been anywhere near MVP form this series. Klay outshines him every night.

Bfw
J jburman82Member
Bad time for GSW to go cold. Everyone not Curry started the game 1-17 from three. They were open looks too, just not falling.

Game 7 will be very interesting, especially if Iggy is as limited as he was in game 6. Injury luck is a big part of winning a title and it looks like it has swung to Cleveland now after brutalizing them last year.
doubleddoubledMember
quote:
Originally posted by patespo1:
quote:
Originally posted by GlennK:
Shocking game tonight. An all time performance for Lebron. Curry got screwed on a couple calls but acted like a baby. Game 7 will be interesting.


+1 to each statement.
Nothing like a Game 7 in the NBA Finals. Go Cavs!

Watching the last 2 minutes of Game 6, it was pretty interesting that those same five players were playing a lot of minutes in last year's Finals. Although Love isn't the impact player that most people thought he was going to be, he is clearly an upgrade from the 2015 supporting cast.

Oh, I expect those calls against Curry to be going the other direction in Game 7. But still, Go Cavs! Dom needs some Doms from TPE. Smile
E eyesintimeMember
These Finals have been very strange in that the most interesting things have been off the court and the momentum swings. The games have been for the most part bad. I think I saw where this is the first time the first six games in a series that will go seven have all been decided by 10+ points -- and most it seems by a lot more than that.

Even though I've found most of the games relatively boring, I'll watch game 7. Hopefully it will be a good game so I actually watch it start to finish. Certainly has great storylines. Living in Ohio, I'd like to see the Cavs win, but I find it difficult to cheer for Lebron. Though I have to admit that of late Green and Curry are making it easier to root for Cleveland.
winetarelliwinetarelliMember
quote:
Originally posted by vinole:
LBJ puts on a performance for the ages and cements his legacy by leading the first team to win a Finals series after being down 3-1. Cleveland's 51+ year title drought comes to a resounding end by beating one of the best teams in NBA history.

Well put.

Just incredible.

So happy for the people of Cleveland -- one of the greatest sports towns in the country.
patespo1patespo1Member
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by Italian Wino:
Congrats to the city of Cleveland. Coming back from that 3-1 deficit is very special.

IW

And make sure patespo didn't hit his head from passing out


I can't stop crying. 42 years of heartache over!!! We the Champs tonight!!! Popping bottles for many, many months to come !
D danyullMember
quote:
Originally posted by patespo1:
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by Italian Wino:
Congrats to the city of Cleveland. Coming back from that 3-1 deficit is very special.

IW

And make sure patespo didn't hit his head from passing out


I can't stop crying. 42 years of heartache over!!! We the Champs tonight!!! Popping bottles for many, many months to come !


It kills me that GS lost...

But congratz to your city and the Cavs!
patespo1patespo1Member
quote:
Originally posted by Danyull:
quote:
Originally posted by patespo1:
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by Italian Wino:
Congrats to the city of Cleveland. Coming back from that 3-1 deficit is very special.

IW

And make sure patespo didn't hit his head from passing out


I can't stop crying. 42 years of heartache over!!! We the Champs tonight!!! Popping bottles for many, many months to come !


It kills me that GS lost...

But congratz to your city and the Cavs!


Thanks DK! Sorry we won't be able to share a celebratory glass in Tahoe, but I'll be thinking of you
J jburman82Member
quote:
Originally posted by billhike:
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
Very happy for LBJ. He was his usual force of nature self in this historic upset. So pissed that tiny turd Gilbert gets to pretend he did anything to bring a title to Cleveland.

I would think bringing LBJ back and swallowing some pride after "The Letter" qualifies, no?


Hell no. He just happens to own a team in the same as area that one of the greatest players ever was born. He's a clown.
J jcocktostenMember
Yuck - too bad I wanted the Warriors to win.

That third foul call on Curry was ridiculous but the Warriors can only blame themselves. Klay Thompson looked horrible

LeBron was in full beast mode - played the way he always should in those last 3 games. I find him incredibly annoying (and he was on the Heat as well when I rooted for him) but obviously crushed it.

I will admit I watched Game of Thrones instead of the second half.
T tpewinedrinkerMember
quote:
Originally posted by billhike:
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
Very happy for LBJ. He was his usual force of nature self in this historic upset. So pissed that tiny turd Gilbert gets to pretend he did anything to bring a title to Cleveland.

I would think bringing LBJ back and swallowing some pride after "The Letter" qualifies, no?

You would swallow some pride too if your team instantly became $350m richer by bringing back Lebron. Let's not try and spin a narrative that Gilbert was being altruistic in bringing back Lebron, cause that is bogus. It was about money.
S scbeermanMember
This was a historic comeback led by the will of Lebron James. He is easily the best all around player that I have ever seen as he can do more things on the court than any player ever. His shot blocking ability on Warrior drives to the hoop was the difference in this game. This championship puts his all time status in a new dimension. Wow!
billhikebillhikeMember
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
quote:
Originally posted by billhike:
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
Very happy for LBJ. He was his usual force of nature self in this historic upset. So pissed that tiny turd Gilbert gets to pretend he did anything to bring a title to Cleveland.

I would think bringing LBJ back and swallowing some pride after "The Letter" qualifies, no?

You would swallow some pride too if your team instantly became $350m richer by bringing back Lebron. Let's not try and spin a narrative that Gilbert was being altruistic in bringing back Lebron, cause that is bogus. It was about money.

I wasn't trying to spin anything, merely replying to a comment with my opinion. Some sports fans can't accept thoughts that differ from theirs, I guess. Oh well. Have a great week.
T tpewinedrinkerMember
quote:
Originally posted by billhike:
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
quote:
Originally posted by billhike:
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
Very happy for LBJ. He was his usual force of nature self in this historic upset. So pissed that tiny turd Gilbert gets to pretend he did anything to bring a title to Cleveland.

I would think bringing LBJ back and swallowing some pride after "The Letter" qualifies, no?

You would swallow some pride too if your team instantly became $350m richer by bringing back Lebron. Let's not try and spin a narrative that Gilbert was being altruistic in bringing back Lebron, cause that is bogus. It was about money.

I wasn't trying to spin anything, merely replying to a comment with my opinion. Some sports fans can't accept thoughts that differ from theirs, I guess. Oh well. Have a great week.

i was merely doing the same. it's all good.
G gigabitMember
I thought this would be a sweep for GS after Games 1 and 2.

After the Cavs won Game 3, but then lost Game 4, I thought GSW would win Game 5 (despite the absence of Green). It was Game 5 that caused me to believe that Cleveland had a chance to win the series. Everything changed in that game, psychologically. I saw hints of doubt from the Warriors and strong belief from the Cavs.

Game 6 completely swung the momentum in favor of the Cavs. GS, including their coach, appeared at a loss for answers to Cleveland's game plan.

Sitting at brunch yesterday with a large group of friends and family, the majority thought that GS would win Game 7. I thought that Cleveland's momentum and confidence would carry them to victory.

I'm very happy for the city of Cleveland; especially my friends and neighbors that have shared (with me) the pain and heartbreak of numerous defeats that span decades.

Lastly, any remaining doubt about the greatness of Lebron James' should be extinguished. His performance in Games 5-7 surpasses anything I've seen in NBA Finals history.
vinolevinoleMember
quote:
Originally posted by eyesintime:
quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
is tyronne lue the only coach to win a finals after only caoching half the season?


I believe I heard on Sportscenter last night that two others had done it, but not sure who. Didn't Pat Riley come out of the GM suite in mid-season to coach the Heat's first championship?


Correct. Riley took over from Stan Van Gundy 21 games into the season in 12/05.
doubleddoubledMember
quote:
Originally posted by gigabit:
Lastly, any remaining doubt about the greatness of Lebron James' should be extinguished.

I have never doubted LBJ's greatness. However, the question for me was whether he belonged on the same level as MJ, Russell, Magic, and Kobe (if you were to have a starting five). There are a lot of great players who have won championships - Bird, Duncan, Shaq, Oscar, etc. It was a matter of determining his place in the Hall.
T tpewinedrinkerMember
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by gigabit:
Lastly, any remaining doubt about the greatness of Lebron James' should be extinguished.

I have never doubted LBJ's greatness. However, the question for me was whether he belonged on the same level as MJ, Russell, Magic, and Kobe (if you were to have a starting five). There are a lot of great players who have won championships - Bird, Duncan, Shaq, Oscar, etc. It was a matter of determining his place in the Hall.

Putting Kobe ahead of Duncan??? Say it ain't so. You got 3 out of 4 right... Kobe will never belong ahead of Timmy. Ever. Magic, MJ, Lebron, Duncan and Russell. Kareem, Bird, Kobe, Wilt and West.
bomba503bomba503Member
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by gigabit:
Lastly, any remaining doubt about the greatness of Lebron James' should be extinguished.

I have never doubted LBJ's greatness. However, the question for me was whether he belonged on the same level as MJ, Russell, Magic, and Kobe (if you were to have a starting five). There are a lot of great players who have won championships - Bird, Duncan, Shaq, Oscar, etc. It was a matter of determining his place in the Hall.

Putting Kobe ahead of Duncan??? Say it ain't so. You got 3 out of 4 right... Kobe will never belong ahead of Timmy. Ever. Magic, MJ, Lebron, Duncan and Russell. Kareem, Bird, Kobe, Wilt and West.


Yup and thx for putting Wilt in there who should be above Russell imo
L lakersguyMember
quote:
Originally posted by vinole:
quote:
Originally posted by eyesintime:
quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
is tyronne lue the only coach to win a finals after only caoching half the season?


I believe I heard on Sportscenter last night that two others had done it, but not sure who. Didn't Pat Riley come out of the GM suite in mid-season to coach the Heat's first championship?


Correct. Riley took over from Stan Van Gundy 21 games into the season in 12/05.


Also, Pat Riley came out of the broadcast booth in 1981-82 when the Lakers fired Paul Westhead and lead them to a Championship that year.
doubleddoubledMember
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
That's a poor way to judge things DD. Those Celtic teams had a starting 5 of HOFers.

Let me see. Wilt played most of his career with 2 other HoF (Arizin and Gola on the Philadelphia Warriors teams; Cunningham, Greer, and Walker on the 76ers; Baylor and West on the Lakers). Yet, he only has 2 championships. He was a prolific scorer, but he was also half-foot taller than most of other players. When the other team had a decent center - whether its Russell or Kareem - his teams fell short.
S seaquamMember
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
Wilt will never be above Russell. Get real. Wilt might have only been the 3rd best Lakers center... He certainly was not as good as Kareem and may have only been marginally better than Shaq.



I think when you're looking at basketball-- which has had so many great players-- and trying to determine who are the greatest of all time, to break a tie you pretty much have to go with the total number of women whom the players have claimed to have slept with.


Point/game/match: Wilt!
robsutherlandrobsutherlandMember
quote:
Originally posted by Seaquam:
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
Wilt will never be above Russell. Get real. Wilt might have only been the 3rd best Lakers center... He certainly was not as good as Kareem and may have only been marginally better than Shaq.



I think when you're looking at basketball-- which has had so many great players-- and trying to determine who are the greatest of all time, to break a tie you pretty much have to go with the total number of women whom the players have claimed to have slept with.


Point/game/match: Wilt!


Finally some lucidity to this argument!
glennkglennkMember
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
Putting Kobe ahead of Duncan??? Say it ain't so. You got 3 out of 4 right... Kobe will never belong ahead of Timmy. Ever. Magic, MJ, Lebron, Duncan and Russell. Kareem, Bird, Kobe, Wilt and West.
I'm obviously biased but I would take Kobe all day everyday. Kobe carried a bigger load IMO and Timmy had a better supporting cast over his career and the benefit of having Pop as his coach. Besides Phil, Kobe has played for some jokers. That and I hated Timmy's "I was fouled face" every time another player brushed against him. Big Grin
G g-manMember
quote:
Originally posted by Seaquam:
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
Wilt will never be above Russell. Get real. Wilt might have only been the 3rd best Lakers center... He certainly was not as good as Kareem and may have only been marginally better than Shaq.



I think when you're looking at basketball-- which has had so many great players-- and trying to determine who are the greatest of all time, to break a tie you pretty much have to go with the total number of women whom the players have claimed to have slept with.


Point/game/match: Wilt!


you guys nuts

it's Kareem, then Shaq, then russell, and finally wilt.
J jburman82Member
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
That's a poor way to judge things DD. Those Celtic teams had a starting 5 of HOFers.

Let me see. Wilt played most of his career with 2 other HoF (Arizin and Gola on the Philadelphia Warriors teams; Cunningham, Greer, and Walker on the 76ers; Baylor and West on the Lakers). Yet, he only has 2 championships. He was a prolific scorer, but he was also half-foot taller than most of other players. When the other team had a decent center - whether its Russell or Kareem - his teams fell short.


Those Celtics teams had 7 HOFers. Russell clearly had more team achievements. That in and of itself doesn't mean one player is better than another. I don't know who was better. I never saw either of them play. I just find ranking players based on the team accomplishments arbitrary and capricious.
patespo1patespo1Member
quote:
Originally posted by Vino Bevo:
As a Spurs fan I wasn't overly interested with the finals, but am happy for the people of Cleveland. I remember the tears I got watching the Spurs exit the plane after landing at SAT with the first championship trophy in '99 and am glad they get to feel a similar joy.


Thanks for the thought; I've been crying since last night. I knew a Cleveland team eventually winning a championship would be great, but it actually is better than I thought. And on Father's Day, sitting next to my oldest son; will never forget it.
G g-manMember
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
you guys nuts

it's Kareem, then Shaq, then russell, and finally wilt.

You must be using acting skills in your rankings. I agree that Kareem's Airplane was much better than Shaq's Kazaam.


if shaq was playing in teh 60s-70s. they'd probably make up even more rules about not being able to play downlow.
L lakersguyMember
quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
you guys nuts

it's Kareem, then Shaq, then russell, and finally wilt.

You must be using acting skills in your rankings. I agree that Kareem's Airplane was much better than Shaq's Kazaam.


if shaq was playing in teh 60s-70s. they'd probably make up even more rules about not being able to play downlow.


There is no way and I am biased for Laker players, that Shaq was better than Bill Russell. Kareem, Russell, Shaq and Wilt however if Wilt played during Shaq's era an worked out, Wilt never did except in rooms, It would of been close between the two of them.
bomba503bomba503Member
Not sure how you put Russell above wilt. Russell played on loaded teams his whole career and was mostly a defensive/rebounding specialist. Wilt was a scoring machine who had twice as many points and was on par with rebounds with Russell while not far behind on defense. I think most of you are too young to have seen these guys play.
T tpewinedrinkerMember
quote:
Originally posted by BOMBA503:
Not sure how you put Russell above wilt. Russell played on loaded teams his whole career and was mostly a defensive/rebounding specialist. Wilt was a scoring machine who had twice as many points and was on par with rebounds with Russell while not far behind on defense. I think most of you are too young to have seen these guys play.

Wilt was a stat padder, plain and simple. He was a coach killer too... He led the league in assists one year to spite his coach, not because it gave them the best chance to win. Russell didn't care about stats... He cared about rings.
G g-manMember
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
G-man: Shaq may have been the most dominant physically... Doesn't mean he was the best or the most skilled. Same as you in a jr high girls' league... You may be the most dominant physically. Doesn't mean you are the best or most skilled. Wink


in my jr high girl's league, i've got botht he biggest cock and balls ;-)

oh and i happen to be the best an the most skilled.

and a) shaq is so good, that all they can do is put him at the free throw line b) clearly you have no idea what you're talking about, shaq was also one of the quickest big men to ever play this league.

speaking of skilled, let me know how many big men did the below:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAglVkIIy0Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3xnFIvXeD0
glennkglennkMember
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
I am not saying Shaq isn't a great player. I don't think he's better than Duncan.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZhIJjJOUJ8

I can probably find more videos where he is outplayed by a superior player.
DD not sure that series (2001 WCF) is a good example that Duncan was better than Shaq. Shaq averaged 27 and 13 while shooting 54% leading the lakers to an easy sweep of the Spurs.

Speaking of Kobe vs Duncan from up thread, Kobe in the series averaged 33, 7 and 7 shooting over 50%. Duncan had a long period playing at a real high level but the highs were not as high as Kobe.
J jburman82Member
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
Without Kobe or Wade, Shaq has no rings.

That is such a false narrative. Here are Kobe's shooting stats game by game from the first finals against Indy, 6-13, 1-3, 14-27, 4-20, 8-27. Here they are for the finals against Philly, 7-22, 11-23, 13-30, 6-13, 7-18. There was one really good game in each of those series. Kobe wasn't Kobe when LA started winning titles. That was all Shaq just killing people.

Yes Shaq's ring with Wade came because Wade went off attacking the basket but he was able to because Dallas insisted on doubling Shaq all the time.

Also, Hakeem doesn't win without Drexler. Duncan doesn't win without Robinson and Manu and Parker. It takes more than one person to win a championship.
G g-manMember
quote:
Originally posted by GlennK:
Duncan had a long period playing at a real high level but the highs were not as high as Kobe.


you meant shaq

duncan has never ever reached the highs that shaq ever reached.

doubled is still nuts thinking duncan was remotely as good as shaq was.

for every one video you can see duncan make a little jump shot against shaq, i can find 7-8x videos of duncan just tearing down the rim against anyone the spurs threw against him
J jburman82Member
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
Shaq will get his points because of his size and always standing 3-feet from the basket. Moving him just 3 feet further - whether it's on the offensive or defensive side - and he became a non-factor. His championships were the result of being teamed with Kobe and Wade.


Physical advantages are a part of the game. Power is a part of the game. You cant ignore that. Kobe got his first three and Wade got his first directly because of Shaq. Unless you think that Wade/Odom/Brian Grant Heat team was going win one.

Shaq 2000 playoffs - 30pts/15rbs/3ast/2.5blk on 57% shooting
Kobe 2000 playoffs - 21/4/4/1.5 on 44% shooting

Thanks be to jebus that Kobe was there to bail out Shaq.
L lakersguyMember
quote:
Originally posted by BOMBA503:
Not sure how you put Russell above wilt. Russell played on loaded teams his whole career and was mostly a defensive/rebounding specialist. Wilt was a scoring machine who had twice as many points and was on par with rebounds with Russell while not far behind on defense. I think most of you are too young to have seen these guys play.
I saw Bill Russell beat my Lakers every year in the 60's. Boston does not win those championships without Bill Russell.
S scbeermanMember
Maybe it is my age, but the dominance of Lew Alcindor aka Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is not being given its proper attention. IMHO, he is still the best basketball player that I have seen play.

First, he led UCLA to three NCAA titles, all by wide margins. That was when freshman could not play or it would have been four titles. They banned the dunk in college ball after Alcindor's first season due to his dominance. Other than Bill Walton, it is not even close that he had the best college career ever.

Abdul-Jabbar is the NBAs all time leader in points scored, and third in rebounds and blocked shots. He played 20 years, a factor which has to be considered in greatness. He had six titles and five MVPs.

Both Shaq and Duncan were never close to playing at Jabbar's level in college. Jordan played on a dynasty team close to Jabbar's in college, and only got one title in three years.
G g-manMember
quote:
Originally posted by scbeerman:
Maybe it is my age, but the dominance of Lew Alcindor aka Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is not being given its proper attention. IMHO, he is still the best basketball player that I have seen play.

First, he led UCLA to three NCAA titles, all by wide margins. That was when freshman could not play or it would have been four titles. They banned the dunk in college ball after Alcindor's first season due to his dominance. Other than Bill Walton, it is not even close that he had the best college career ever.

Abdul-Jabbar is the NBAs all time leader in points scored, and third in rebounds and blocked shots. He played 20 years, a factor which has to be considered in greatness. He had six titles and five MVPs.

Both Shaq and Duncan were never close to playing at Jabbar's level in college. Jordan played on a dynasty team close to Jabbar's in college, and only got one title in three years.


nooo

we started teh convo with

quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
you guys nuts

it's Kareem, then Shaq, then russell, and finally wilt.
.
=)
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