Skip to main content

Not sure how you put Russell above wilt. Russell played on loaded teams his whole career and was mostly a defensive/rebounding specialist. Wilt was a scoring machine who had twice as many points and was on par with rebounds with Russell while not far behind on defense. I think most of you are too young to have seen these guys play.
quote:
Originally posted by BOMBA503:
Not sure how you put Russell above wilt. Russell played on loaded teams his whole career and was mostly a defensive/rebounding specialist. Wilt was a scoring machine who had twice as many points and was on par with rebounds with Russell while not far behind on defense. I think most of you are too young to have seen these guys play.

Wilt was a stat padder, plain and simple. He was a coach killer too... He led the league in assists one year to spite his coach, not because it gave them the best chance to win. Russell didn't care about stats... He cared about rings.
quote:
Originally posted by TPEwinedrinker:
G-man: Shaq may have been the most dominant physically... Doesn't mean he was the best or the most skilled. Same as you in a jr high girls' league... You may be the most dominant physically. Doesn't mean you are the best or most skilled. Wink


in my jr high girl's league, i've got botht he biggest cock and balls ;-)

oh and i happen to be the best an the most skilled.

and a) shaq is so good, that all they can do is put him at the free throw line b) clearly you have no idea what you're talking about, shaq was also one of the quickest big men to ever play this league.

speaking of skilled, let me know how many big men did the below:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAglVkIIy0Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3xnFIvXeD0
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
I am not saying Shaq isn't a great player. I don't think he's better than Duncan.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZhIJjJOUJ8

I can probably find more videos where he is outplayed by a superior player.
DD not sure that series (2001 WCF) is a good example that Duncan was better than Shaq. Shaq averaged 27 and 13 while shooting 54% leading the lakers to an easy sweep of the Spurs.

Speaking of Kobe vs Duncan from up thread, Kobe in the series averaged 33, 7 and 7 shooting over 50%. Duncan had a long period playing at a real high level but the highs were not as high as Kobe.
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
Without Kobe or Wade, Shaq has no rings.

That is such a false narrative. Here are Kobe's shooting stats game by game from the first finals against Indy, 6-13, 1-3, 14-27, 4-20, 8-27. Here they are for the finals against Philly, 7-22, 11-23, 13-30, 6-13, 7-18. There was one really good game in each of those series. Kobe wasn't Kobe when LA started winning titles. That was all Shaq just killing people.

Yes Shaq's ring with Wade came because Wade went off attacking the basket but he was able to because Dallas insisted on doubling Shaq all the time.

Also, Hakeem doesn't win without Drexler. Duncan doesn't win without Robinson and Manu and Parker. It takes more than one person to win a championship.
quote:
Originally posted by GlennK:
Duncan had a long period playing at a real high level but the highs were not as high as Kobe.


you meant shaq

duncan has never ever reached the highs that shaq ever reached.

doubled is still nuts thinking duncan was remotely as good as shaq was.

for every one video you can see duncan make a little jump shot against shaq, i can find 7-8x videos of duncan just tearing down the rim against anyone the spurs threw against him
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
Shaq will get his points because of his size and always standing 3-feet from the basket. Moving him just 3 feet further - whether it's on the offensive or defensive side - and he became a non-factor. His championships were the result of being teamed with Kobe and Wade.


Physical advantages are a part of the game. Power is a part of the game. You cant ignore that. Kobe got his first three and Wade got his first directly because of Shaq. Unless you think that Wade/Odom/Brian Grant Heat team was going win one.

Shaq 2000 playoffs - 30pts/15rbs/3ast/2.5blk on 57% shooting
Kobe 2000 playoffs - 21/4/4/1.5 on 44% shooting

Thanks be to jebus that Kobe was there to bail out Shaq.
quote:
Originally posted by BOMBA503:
Not sure how you put Russell above wilt. Russell played on loaded teams his whole career and was mostly a defensive/rebounding specialist. Wilt was a scoring machine who had twice as many points and was on par with rebounds with Russell while not far behind on defense. I think most of you are too young to have seen these guys play.
I saw Bill Russell beat my Lakers every year in the 60's. Boston does not win those championships without Bill Russell.
Maybe it is my age, but the dominance of Lew Alcindor aka Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is not being given its proper attention. IMHO, he is still the best basketball player that I have seen play.

First, he led UCLA to three NCAA titles, all by wide margins. That was when freshman could not play or it would have been four titles. They banned the dunk in college ball after Alcindor's first season due to his dominance. Other than Bill Walton, it is not even close that he had the best college career ever.

Abdul-Jabbar is the NBAs all time leader in points scored, and third in rebounds and blocked shots. He played 20 years, a factor which has to be considered in greatness. He had six titles and five MVPs.

Both Shaq and Duncan were never close to playing at Jabbar's level in college. Jordan played on a dynasty team close to Jabbar's in college, and only got one title in three years.
quote:
Originally posted by scbeerman:
Maybe it is my age, but the dominance of Lew Alcindor aka Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is not being given its proper attention. IMHO, he is still the best basketball player that I have seen play.

First, he led UCLA to three NCAA titles, all by wide margins. That was when freshman could not play or it would have been four titles. They banned the dunk in college ball after Alcindor's first season due to his dominance. Other than Bill Walton, it is not even close that he had the best college career ever.

Abdul-Jabbar is the NBAs all time leader in points scored, and third in rebounds and blocked shots. He played 20 years, a factor which has to be considered in greatness. He had six titles and five MVPs.

Both Shaq and Duncan were never close to playing at Jabbar's level in college. Jordan played on a dynasty team close to Jabbar's in college, and only got one title in three years.


nooo

we started teh convo with

quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
you guys nuts

it's Kareem, then Shaq, then russell, and finally wilt.
.
=)
quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
duncan has never ever reached the highs that shaq ever reached.

doubled is still nuts thinking duncan was remotely as good as shaq was.

Umm ... Duncan won 4 championships (5 with David Robinson) with no other future HoF on the roster. Robinson was around for the second championship but played a very minor role and last year before retiring.
quote:
Originally posted by scbeerman:
Maybe it is my age, but the dominance of Lew Alcindor aka Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is not being given its proper attention. IMHO, he is still the best basketball player that I have seen play.

First, he led UCLA to three NCAA titles, all by wide margins. That was when freshman could not play or it would have been four titles. They banned the dunk in college ball after Alcindor's first season due to his dominance. Other than Bill Walton, it is not even close that he had the best college career ever.

Abdul-Jabbar is the NBAs all time leader in points scored, and third in rebounds and blocked shots. He played 20 years, a factor which has to be considered in greatness. He had six titles and five MVPs.

Both Shaq and Duncan were never close to playing at Jabbar's level in college. Jordan played on a dynasty team close to Jabbar's in college, and only got one title in three years.
Completely agree. Kareem is the GOAT basketball player ever.
quote:
Originally posted by Lakersguy:
quote:
Originally posted by BOMBA503:
Not sure how you put Russell above wilt. Russell played on loaded teams his whole career and was mostly a defensive/rebounding specialist. Wilt was a scoring machine who had twice as many points and was on par with rebounds with Russell while not far behind on defense. I think most of you are too young to have seen these guys play.
I saw Bill Russell beat my Lakers every year in the 60's. Boston does not win those championships without Bill Russell.

Exactly. Without Russell, Wilt runs over the Celtics.
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
duncan has never ever reached the highs that shaq ever reached.

doubled is still nuts thinking duncan was remotely as good as shaq was.

Umm ... Duncan won 4 championships (5 with David Robinson) with no other future HoF on the roster. Robinson was around for the second championship but played a very minor role and last year before retiring.


and he lost to shaq and the lakers

and the 06-07 onward season duncan winning was most certainly attributed to weak competition and a great coach in pop. duncan was at best a piece.

manu and parker were both 19-20 ppg players with duncan's 20
san antonio had a more balanced team and still have that very balanced team.

you know who else was on shaq's team besides a piss poor shooting kobe? (45% 2pg 25% 3pt) derek fisher ...

kobe had his most efficient seasons with shaq. It just shows you that all the attention focused on shaq, he truly made his team better. Tim duncan never commanded anywhere near as many double / triple teams as shaq did.
Heck same story with Wade. Wade was definitely good before, but shaq made him that much more efficient. Less wasted shots, more open looks, more assists per game. He dipped when shaq left, and when lebron came into the picture his stats picked up again.
quote:
Originally posted by Lakersguy:
quote:
Originally posted by BOMBA503:
Not sure how you put Russell above wilt. Russell played on loaded teams his whole career and was mostly a defensive/rebounding specialist. Wilt was a scoring machine who had twice as many points and was on par with rebounds with Russell while not far behind on defense. I think most of you are too young to have seen these guys play.
I saw Bill Russell beat my Lakers every year in the 60's. Boston does not win those championships without Bill Russell.


No argument but they don't win them without the rest of the HOF roster either. Wilt did it all and was a multi sport athlete. He had a 50" vertical leap! He scored 30 a game when The league was far more physical. The best guys he played with were Billy C and Hal Greer. Solid players but none widely known or respected anywhere near the guys Russell played with. But that's what makes this fun. There is no right answer, just opinions.
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
duncan has never ever reached the highs that shaq ever reached.

doubled is still nuts thinking duncan was remotely as good as shaq was.

Umm ... Duncan won 4 championships (5 with David Robinson) with no other future HoF on the roster. Robinson was around for the second championship but played a very minor role and last year before retiring.


What are you talking about???? Parker, Ginobli and Leonard are all future HOFers.
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
I know we're all debating with hypotheticals. I think Kareem was a better player from Shaq, but Kareem doesn't win the titles from the '80s without Magic. And as Magic proved, the Lakers won a title without Kareem.

I am not aware of a title Magic won with the Lakers without Kareem. I don't think that happened. Unless your meaning the game where Kareem got hurt and Magice played center, 1980. But Kareem was on the team.
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
quote:
Originally posted by DoubleD:
quote:
Originally posted by jburman82:
What are you talking about???? Parker, Ginobli and Leonard are all future HOFers.

Puhlease ... your HoF bar is really low. Should I expect Danny Ainge to be elected soon?


$100 on each of them they get in.

First ballot for both?

Add Reply

Post
×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×