Skip to main content

The final books will never be written.

I think that George RR Martin has written himself into a corner with the last books with far too many open and expanding plot lines, and is neither interested nor motivated nor contractually obligated to complete them. 

He's been living the good life as a wildly successful writer (not that I blame him at all) and he isn't getting any younger.

He really should just hire a team of writers to finish up the novels for him, and just attend high-level meetings to work out the final plots and goals.

This one was very disappointing.  

The dragons being ambushed by a fleet is about as realistic as the US battleships ambushing the Japanese planes on December 7, 1941.

Cersei not killing Tyrion is completely irrational and against her character.  Didn't she just hire Bronn to kill him and Jaime?  And there he is, standing right below the gates.  And while she's willing to send a message by killing Missandei, she isn't willing to kill Tyrion?  Does he just turn around and walk away.

And Jon Snow tells his sisters his big "secret" which, as Varys points out, is no longer a secret but is information.  And Sansa immediately blabs; so much for the power of her word.

Really, I was tempted to turn off the tv.

Rothko posted:

This one was very disappointing.  

The dragons being ambushed by a fleet is about as realistic as the US battleships ambushing the Japanese planes on December 7, 1941.

Cersei not killing Tyrion is completely irrational and against her character.  Didn't she just hire Bronn to kill him and Jaime?  And there he is, standing right below the gates.  And while she's willing to send a message by killing Missandei, she isn't willing to kill Tyrion?  Does he just turn around and walk away.

And Jon Snow tells his sisters his big "secret" which, as Varys points out, is no longer a secret but is information.  And Sansa immediately blabs; so much for the power of her word.

Really, I was tempted to turn off the tv.

I wasn’t as disappointed as you. But it definitely felt like “Ok. We need the following things to happen in episodes 5 and 6, so let’s do everything to set those episodes up, irrespective of ultimate storytelling quality.”

Looking forward to next week, though. 

This season has been disappointing, so far. 

At this point, the characters have become tired and predictable; the story-line implausible; the script weak; and editing very poor.   (We waited two years for this?)

How many shots of Tyrion pouting, Danaerys glaring, and Cersei scowling must we endure?

Frankly, I don't care how it ends; I just want it to end.

SPOILER ALERT:

Well that puts this great show in the impossible position of trying to get redemption or revenge in one episode. It was kind of like--what exactly have we been watching Daenery for years for? Notice there was no close-up or even a full frame view of her during the rampage. While I don't know what to make of this penultimate episode I still put this as the third best mini-series after The Wire and Battlestar Galactica.

I said eight years ago they'd never be able to pull this off, and with all those kids actors that often don't turn out well as adult actors and the very large cast that would have to be available year after year, I really didn't think they'd be able to keep it together.  Add in often great cinematography, special effects and smart directing it's a series that should stand near the top of similar efforts for a long time.

Last edited by The Old Man

I actually thought that episode was a bit weak-sauce. Too much slow motion, too much repetitive shots, especially in the second half. <spoiler alert> I expected the last word of the episode to be “Daenerys Targaryen”. I would put at least even odds on Arya doing a twofer. And, “you know nothing, Jon Snow” seems super appropriate here. I was also saddened by Tyrion turning in Varys. But, still enjoyable. A lot has to happen in one episode. 

Overall, it is hard for me to rank this vompared to other TV dramas. But, in terms of entire runs, the only TV drama I’ve seen that I would put even near GOT is The Americans. Which did actually land the plane nearly perfectly. 

sunnylea57 posted:

I wanted Cersei to yell down at them, "I fart in your general direction!"

I'm with Gig and Rothko in the disappointed camp. The writers seemed to be in a big hurry to end this series.And the belief suspension required is off the scales. Gregor with a sword through the head?

And that is not the way I wanted Cersei to die. Something much slower and far more painful. I am assuming she is dead, which may not be the case.

steve8 posted

I'm with Gig and Rothko in the disappointed camp. The writers seemed to be in a big hurry to end this series.And the belief suspension required is off the scales. Gregor with a sword through the head?

And that is not the way I wanted Cersei to die. Something much slower and far more painful. I am assuming she is dead, which may not be the case.

The Mountain is undead. This knife action and the Mountain's state of existence is pure H.P. Lovecraft. Martin is a fan.

Cersei is dead, and not making viewers/readers happy is the way it goes in Martin's world.

Last edited by The Old Man

I am catching up as I could not watch the last 2 episodes when we were in Portugal -I largely know what happens and sort of dread watching but . . .

I really don't get the surprise about Dany burning King's Landing - from both the books and show - to me this has seemed fairly obvious - watching episode 4 - it was clearly going to happen - her entitlement which was always there has only gotten greater as the show has proceeded.  Perhaps its just me, but when I re-read the books I normally skip all Dany chapters as I simply can't stand her or her story line

Scenes with Jon in episode 4 clearly show what her reaction is going to be in episode 5 - so all this talk about D & D not earning the payoff and ruining her character etc. seem like a lot of BS to me. Are the last 2 seasons rushed?  Of course - but I am of the camp of giving them a break. I love the books (as I love most good fantasy series) and what they have done making the world care so much about it is an amazing feat as far as I am concerned.

jcocktosten posted:

I am catching up as I could not watch the last 2 episodes when we were in Portugal -I largely know what happens and sort of dread watching but . . .

I really don't get the surprise about Dany burning King's Landing - from both the books and show - to me this has seemed fairly obvious - watching episode 4 - it was clearly going to happen - her entitlement which was always there has only gotten greater as the show has proceeded.  Perhaps its just me, but when I re-read the books I normally skip all Dany chapters as I simply can't stand her or her story line

Scenes with Jon in episode 4 clearly show what her reaction is going to be in episode 5 - so all this talk about D & D not earning the payoff and ruining her character etc. seem like a lot of BS to me. Are the last 2 seasons rushed?  Of course - but I am of the camp of giving them a break. I love the books (as I love most good fantasy series) and what they have done making the world care so much about it is an amazing feat as far as I am concerned.

I'm with you..all the fuss seems a bit silly.  It is only a TV show after all.  But agree the writing is weaker without Martin driving the bus....they are writing for a TV audience, not a reading audience.

gigabit posted:
jcocktosten posted:

And it would have made much more sense for Jon to choose to go North rather than the Unsullied and Grey Worm deciding it for some reason

Speaking of the Unsullied, how is it that they and the Dothraki magically multiplied into thousands and hundreds of soldiers?

That was my other question - especially the Dothraki . . .

None of it really matters - I am ultimately happy and despite all the complaints (many legit. and many manufactured) - I giveBenioff and Weiss, Cogman, the directors and the actors credit for their momentous achievement and while I have quibbles for sure - I am reasonably satisfied.  

I am reasonably satisfied by the ending, although I have some issues:

I really wanted to see Jon Snow go full Targaryen and take over command of Drogon after Dany's death, fly down and crisp the Unsullied and Dothraki and then declare himself the rightful king of the Seven Kingdoms.

When Sansa declared that the North would be a separate kingdom (because it had been one for centuries before), I wanted to new Prince of Dorne to perk up and say "Uhh, yeah, us too.  We were the only kingdom not conquered by the Targaryens, so we are going our own way also."   And then all the other ones deciding they too would rather be independent.

The Wheel isn't broken.  It's in fine condition.  Here's what's going to happen.  Bran will rule wisely and well, and all the other Houses will rebuild or consolidate their power during the peace.  The Small Council will run the day to day business.  When Bran dies, the Electoral College will appoint a new king.  In time, either this new king or one of his successors will have a son, and will say to himself "I'd like to start a dynasty."  The Small Council will scheme amongst themselves, and the high Houses will start to jockey for power and position, just as they did when Robert died.  Eventually, there will be a new dynasty and we will be right back to where we were.  They should have had Bran say to Sam "I like your idea about the people voting.  I have this idea about a thing called Parliament I'd like to discuss with you."

Are Sansa and Tyrion still married?  I'm not aware that they got a divorce, despite Sansa's second and illegal marriage to Ramsey.  

Is Tyrion the Lord of Casterly Rock now?

Dorne should be the true superpower in Westeros now.  Aren't they the only ones with an intact army left?

Jon Snow going back to the Night's Watch, and I guess becoming the Lord Commander again, was interesting.  What is the Night's Watch role now?  It was too bad they didn't show Tormund with a smoking hot Wildling woman and then turning to Jon Snow and saying "Her twin sister thinks you're cute."

I would have liked a final ending that had either a nest of dragon eggs in Volantis hatching while Drogon watched or one of Craster's sons in the far North opening his eyes and they are "Night King blue".

The Old Man posted:
spo posted:

I wish this show had gone 10-13 seasons like George RR Martin thought it should. HBO 👎

There is no way in the world they could have sustained the show for that long.

Even if they couldn't sustain for another 1 season, they could have received a blank cheque for 10 episodes. D&D decided to finish it in 6. 

At this point in time, GRRM has stated that he is looking to finish the books by July 2020 or something like that. I can only hope in 10 years they do a redo past S6, because the writing got worse and worse. 

spo posted:
The Old Man posted:
spo posted:

I wish this show had gone 10-13 seasons like George RR Martin thought it should. HBO 👎

There is no way in the world they could have sustained the show for that long.

Why do you think that? Not even 10 seasons? 

First this is a very difficult show to produce year and year just because of the logistics and weather. Now through in a very large cast, who pretty much can't be replaced (I think only one major character was recast early in the show.) The two girls--now women--both struggled with various mental issues over the years. Sophie Turner had to deal with years of people hating on her character (though I'm not one of them) until Sansa's major character change.

It's much easier to go 12 seasons on The Big Bang when everyone lives around LA and you're not outside battling the elements.

Last edited by The Old Man
spo posted:

 Some game of thrones news. I heard one of the Game of Thrones spinoff/prequels got cancelled but they will make a show about the Targaryens. I hope they find some good writers.

benioff and Weiss made a confession about not really understanding game of thrones that well ....

I loved GoT and I'm a defender, but not lover, of the final season, but I have no interest in watching anymore tales of Westeros.

spo posted:

 Some game of thrones news. I heard one of the Game of Thrones spinoff/prequels got cancelled but they will make a show about the Targaryens. I hope they find some good writers.

benioff and Weiss made a confession about not really understanding game of thrones that well ....

Is it? Wow I didn't know this. Yeah I hope they find good writers for it.

Add Reply

Post
×
×
×
×
Link copied to your clipboard.
×