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I don't think so but I've also never been in that situation.  Not sure why you need to turn this around about me Bill.

Not what I’m doing. My point was that there was a rule in place for the guy to board the flight. He knew he potentially posed a risk to a lot of people but paid to get around the rule. I know there are infected people all over, (your point that I responded to) that in many cases don’t know they are positive. This jag off knew he was but didn’t care.

@drtannin 2 posted:


Returning back to health issues, COVID joins the flu as an endemic lifetime risk with periodic epidemics. If orthopoxviruses [monkeypox, smallpox] return at large, no one will care about COVID. If states ban contraceptives next, encouraging bounty justice, the R party will lose massive numbers of women and young voters. And, if the health cost of inevitable climate variation affects food resources, well then...it's cellar diminishment time. Living thru the late 60's- early 70's seemed like a test. No, we are now in the real test.

Anyway, so yeah Napacat, our govt R and D, has sucked for quite some time, but it's now worse w/r to health care than it's ever been... in my lifetime.

I honestly think Monkey pox would acutally get folks to pay more attention.  Humans are much more attuned to things that cause deformities vs things that just put you under some man made life saving thingies.

@drtannin 2 posted:

Napacat-

There are plenty of missteps from both political parties to go around.  But the need to have a public health bureau/ branch in govt,  adequate preparation/ plan, response, and motivation for the coronavirus [which is my main focus of my posts here] was in 2019 and 2020.  Failure of many levels then led to: denial, delay and ineffective testing and contact tracing plans, lack of federal support especially ventilators and PPE to states,  no coherent economic policy for businesses that prolonged the pandemic [ vs success by Korea, Taiwan etc] Continued denial, deflection, and arrogance by some the DJT administration, and too many state govts fed into many of the general population to defy any subsequent reasonable policy [eg masking, vaccination], which continues to this day. The subsequent commander in chiefs childish disappearance from the White House for two months after the 2020 election led to further delay in vaccine distribution. Throw in 2021 deflection of "Election Result Validity", "Insurrection", "Russian Interference" and any rapid coherent plan was invariably stalled by these Congressional issues. In my view, handing over this medical disaster with the continued unwillingness of the radical right states, Congress, and antivax community on social media to help fix this, is where the blame of a 1 M death toll lies. It was inevitable, that given this lead time, the virus continues to impact everything and everyone.

Yes, and I don't want to spend too much time on other issues, but D bone head maneuvers in Afghanistan and at the Mexican border make me unhappy, as does the [imo] egregious dispersion of taxpayer funds to liars, cheats and scoundrels etc--- though trillions distributed wo oversight piss me off, but the latter started in 2020, so both administrations bear the burden there. Now, it's the vitriol and hypocrisy of the radical right wing which has taken over the R party that hurts me; Christian Reveling of 'my' Tribe and Hateful Violent Intolerance of all others; Fighting For Freedoms 'I' Like and Banning All Other Ones; Minimal Hands Off Governance but Electing Dictatorial Politicians and Justices.

As an aside, here in VA, the news is all about banning books, not just in libraries, but in stores and on line too. No, I don't think these books about gender are for kids to read, and think history should be vanilla facts with short comments of the multiple sides in conflicts, but complete lunacy has taken over. Pornography is far more graphic and readily available on internet sites , and critical race theory is not taught at the high school level even though the roots of history are often quite ugly. I read science, sports, and occasionally other missives, but I am looking forward to replacement books like  "Getaways on the Public's Dime" by T"Cancun"Cruz; "Space Lasers and Porno Pizza" by MTG;  "My Life w Teenagers" by M Gaetz;  "I'm the real DJT Jr" by RDeSantis; and "It's my Constitution not Yours" by SAlito, and GinnyThomas.

Returning back to health issues, COVID joins the flu as an endemic lifetime risk with periodic epidemics. If orthopoxviruses [monkeypox, smallpox] return at large, no one will care about COVID. If states ban contraceptives next, encouraging bounty justice, the R party will lose massive numbers of women and young voters. And, if the health cost of inevitable climate variation affects food resources, well then...it's cellar diminishment time. Living thru the late 60's- early 70's seemed like a test. No, we are now in the real test.

Anyway, so yeah Napacat, our govt R and D, has sucked for quite some time, but it's now worse w/r to health care than it's ever been... in my lifetime.

Drtanin,

Thanks for the lengthy post.  A lot to decipher here and I cannot do it at the moment.  Other than to say this is a pretty sore society.  Why don 't we want the best for the American people or the country as a whole.  We are destroying ourselves.

Surely the current admin's policies are not the best. Nothing makes sense.  It's depressing and sad.


Have a wonderful Holiday weekend.

Dr. Tannin:

Is it true that the chances of a non-vaccinated person contracting the virus when hanging out with an infected person are greater than the chances of a vaccinated person getting infected when exposed to an infected person?

I have a colleague who has suggested we have lunch.  He is  not vaccinated, and is proud of that, and has had the virus, and feels that he is superimmune.  I have suggested a virtual lunch.  I have no desire to sit across a lunch table with this guy.  Am I being ridiculous?

@irwin posted:


I have a colleague who has suggested we have lunch.  He is  not vaccinated, and is proud of that, and has had the virus, and feels that he is superimmune.  I have suggested a virtual lunch.  I have no desire to sit across a lunch table with this guy.  Am I being ridiculous?

Yes.  Go meet with him.  It’s the only way you can kick him in the junk for being a dangerous idiot.

@patespo1 posted:

This is the third time that I have heard from the far right crowd that the Biden administration is intentionally trying to damage our country, as it is the only explanation for his policies.  I wonder if it is Tucker or Laura that is spouting these theories as they seem to be spreading.  Kind of like the Replacement Theory bullshit.

Do you think it is going well?

@drtannin 2 posted:

Napacat-

There are plenty of missteps from both political parties to go around.  But the need to have a public health bureau/ branch in govt,  adequate preparation/ plan, response, and motivation for the coronavirus [which is my main focus of my posts here] was in 2019 and 2020.  Failure of many levels then led to: denial, delay and ineffective testing and contact tracing plans, lack of federal support especially ventilators and PPE to states,  no coherent economic policy for businesses that prolonged the pandemic [ vs success by Korea, Taiwan etc] Continued denial, deflection, and arrogance by some the DJT administration, and too many state govts fed into many of the general population to defy any subsequent reasonable policy [eg masking, vaccination], which continues to this day. The subsequent commander in chiefs childish disappearance from the White House for two months after the 2020 election led to further delay in vaccine distribution. Throw in 2021 deflection of "Election Result Validity", "Insurrection", "Russian Interference" and any rapid coherent plan was invariably stalled by these Congressional issues. In my view, handing over this medical disaster with the continued unwillingness of the radical right states, Congress, and antivax community on social media to help fix this, is where the blame of a 1 M death toll lies. It was inevitable, that given this lead time, the virus continues to impact everything and everyone.

Yes, and I don't want to spend too much time on other issues, but D bone head maneuvers in Afghanistan and at the Mexican border make me unhappy, as does the [imo] egregious dispersion of taxpayer funds to liars, cheats and scoundrels etc--- though trillions distributed wo oversight piss me off, but the latter started in 2020, so both administrations bear the burden there. Now, it's the vitriol and hypocrisy of the radical right wing which has taken over the R party that hurts me; Christian Reveling of 'my' Tribe and Hateful Violent Intolerance of all others; Fighting For Freedoms 'I' Like and Banning All Other Ones; Minimal Hands Off Governance but Electing Dictatorial Politicians and Justices.

As an aside, here in VA, the news is all about banning books, not just in libraries, but in stores and on line too. No, I don't think these books about gender are for kids to read, and think history should be vanilla facts with short comments of the multiple sides in conflicts, but complete lunacy has taken over. Pornography is far more graphic and readily available on internet sites , and critical race theory is not taught at the high school level even though the roots of history are often quite ugly. I read science, sports, and occasionally other missives, but I am looking forward to replacement books like  "Getaways on the Public's Dime" by T"Cancun"Cruz; "Space Lasers and Porno Pizza" by MTG;  "My Life w Teenagers" by M Gaetz;  "I'm the real DJT Jr" by RDeSantis; and "It's my Constitution not Yours" by SAlito, and GinnyThomas.

Returning back to health issues, COVID joins the flu as an endemic lifetime risk with periodic epidemics. If orthopoxviruses [monkeypox, smallpox] return at large, no one will care about COVID. If states ban contraceptives next, encouraging bounty justice, the R party will lose massive numbers of women and young voters. And, if the health cost of inevitable climate variation affects food resources, well then...it's cellar diminishment time. Living thru the late 60's- early 70's seemed like a test. No, we are now in the real test.

Anyway, so yeah Napacat, our govt R and D, has sucked for quite some time, but it's now worse w/r to health care than it's ever been... in my lifetime.

I can agree with a lot here…not all.  Thanks for the reply.    I do find it odd that you have to have a negative test to fly back to the US, but the Southern border is wide open.  That just leads me to think there is a lack of seriousness at all about COVID.  

@napacat posted:

Great that Musk is making his executives go back to the office for a minimum of 40 Hours a week…or leave.  WELL DONE Elon.  

Why is that great?  Something wrong with remote work?  Some seem to think it's something new but it's been happening for years, just more people doing it now than before the pandemic.  And many studies have shown it to lead to higher productivity and fewer staffing issues.  It worked well in my former place of work.

@bman posted:

Why is that great?  Something wrong with remote work?  Some seem to think it's something new but it's been happening for years, just more people doing it now than before the pandemic.  And many studies have shown it to lead to higher productivity and fewer staffing issues.  It worked well in my former place of work.

There is a lot less of random interaction with intelligent people while working remote.  A lot of great ideas come from being in person with others in the office.  And I am very skeptical of any study that says people are more productive while working from home.

@napacat posted:

There is a lot less of random interaction with intelligent people while working remote.  A lot of great ideas come from being in person with others in the office.  And I am very skeptical of any study that says people are more productive while working from home.

It depends on the nature of the work.  My daughter and son-in-law both work for consulting companies and have worked largely at home for several years, even before COVID.  When they did work away from home, it was to travel to clients, not to go to the office.  In fact, neither has an office as such; rather, there are shared workplaces in the building that they can use if in-person interactions are needed or preferred.  On the other hand, those of us in academia, the sciences, engineering, etc. strongly value in-person interactions, meetings, etc. for just the reasons you state (not just "random," thought, but with intention).  So, there is no right or wrong.  Here is a link to a podcast (with further links to the original article) from a recent study in Nature.

Last edited by haggis
@napacat posted:

There is a lot less of random interaction with intelligent people while working remote.  A lot of great ideas come from being in person with others in the office.  And I am very skeptical of any study that says people are more productive while working from home.

For our business (sales to steel industry) there is a lot of collaboration that happens at the office. Also, since we are a small company (18 ppl) there is a lot of decision making that happens quickly and in person.  
That said, I have also given my employees one day a week of work at home.  I realized during the height of Covid when my people were working at home that production didn’t drop, and from a mental health aspect there were definite benefits of working at home, such as the ability to multitask with work/home duties, getting a break from other co workers, not having to ‘dress up’ for work, etc .  

I think the correct answer is what fits each company best

@napacat posted:

Do you think it is going well?

our issue is folks who don't actually don't understand the issues and just sticking with herd mentality.  It leads to us having by far one of the oldest heads of state, oldest heads of each parts of our governemnt.

Mitch 80, Pelosi 79, Biden 79, Schumer 71, Trump 75.

They are now almost 5 generations removed from the incoming population that they are suppose to consider helping.

So no, I don't think it's going well.  No Trump isnt the answer and it's going to be even more of a shit show since I'm not rich enough to take advantage of most of trump's then policies (which did add the most ever to our national debt, so if you ever want to ask what might have started this inflation thing)

We need new leadership that is indicative of the changing population and we certainly need a smarter electorate that speaks in nuances and not "left/right" as most of us actually aren't this made up concept of left or right

Last edited by g-man
@napacat posted:

There is a lot less of random interaction with intelligent people while working remote.  A lot of great ideas come from being in person with others in the office.  And I am very skeptical of any study that says people are more productive while working from home.

Also a lot fewer random or planned interactions with stupid people and/or time sucks.  Also don't have to spend 1.5 hours a day commuting to sit in front of a computer and attend meetings that accomplish nothing as Teams accomplishes the same goal and achieves the same results.  I'll never go back to the office full time. 

Irwin- If someone is not infectious, their vaccination status doesn't matter to you. Like meeting someone who is well.  If a third party is infectious, then everyone is exposed similarly by  the virus.  However, the unvaccinated colleague is more likely to contract illness from the virus, and far more likely to need hospitalization or die, or persistent disability with long COVID if they do. Natural immunity is not the way to go for several reasons:1- individual responses vary a lot...some not so effective [since many get sick, hospitalized, die, or long COVID in the process just to get this immunity], others less effective and wearing off in same 4-6 month interval, some hyper responses that are great. The problem is you don't know what group you belong to eg an asymptomatic person who contracted COVID doesn't necessarily have 'better' immunity. This is why vaccinations became part of successful public health policy---controlled doses of unharmful attenuated virus to now harmless viral mimicking mRNA strands,  which causes none of those bad responses, but also suffers from temporary responses.  As the virus mutates, both natural and vaccine mediated immunity suffer, since the organism has different antigens.  This is why people get colds or flus on a regular basis, and why our flu vaccines change depending on prevailing strains in Southern Hemisphere.  So you are safe with this guy...to kick him in the balls, for being a dumbs hit homo ignoramus.

napacat- The policy of not testing illegals [if this is true] is illogical as is herding them together to spread virus amongst themselves and others. But I am ignorant about the events at the border.



In general, satiety has numbed us to the ongoing pandemic. Most of us are letting our guard down, accepting higher risks of illness and consequences.  I think of it like moving to and living in a more dangerous neighborhood. Some think it is like living amongst zombies in the movie series "The Living Dead.".  Other serious issues like right to choose and gun and book control are front and center.  It's a lot to chew on, and we have to pick our stresses.  

I am on wine buying hiatus. Prices are up, quality after 1999 down, and my bank account smaller since I recently retired, let alone presumably, my liver not functioning as well as when I was 20.  At least the NY Mets are winning [even w/o Scherzer and deGrom], the youthful Rangers are giving Tampa all they can handle, and summer is here.  Later

@csm posted:

Also a lot fewer random or planned interactions with stupid people and/or time sucks.  

Definitely the biggest benefit of when I was working from home. I was actually happy to go back in after nearly a year once myself, wife and mother got jabs. It’s easier dealing with quality issues in person. Added bonus is we got rid of a few useless persons in the last year.

@billhike posted:

Definitely the biggest benefit of when I was working from home. I was actually happy to go back in after nearly a year once myself, wife and mother got jabs. It’s easier dealing with quality issues in person. Added bonus is we got rid of a few useless persons in the last year.

Have been in a few times since we've been allowed to come in sans masks, and I get next to nothing done.  My job requires focus for extended periods of time and the constant interruptions are the opposite of conducive to accomplishing much.

Looks like the Novavax vaccine is going to win US emergency use authorization.  It will offer a different type of vaccine for those people who didn't want to take the MRNA vaccines.  And of course, it would increase the supply of available vaccines - not so much an issue here anymore, but perhaps abroad.

I wonder if there are still places in the world where people are still trying to get access to vaccines.

If you read the article, none of the explanations of why so many doses have been discarded seem to have anything to do with funding. Besides, if a third of Americans refuse to get the shot it's no surprise so many doses were wasted. Who would have thought so many Americans could be so afraid or deluded or just so stupid, especially compared to Australia, Canada and countries in Europe?

@drtannin 2 posted:

bman-  Did you have to ask????  And screw the Bruins. Go Rangers.

I felt that I did need to ask as it baffles me almost as much as the fact that anyone still thinks a certain former President whose name rhymes with "rump" should be anywhere but in prison.

And why so mean about the Bruins?  I may stop cheering for the Rangers to win the Cup this year if you're gonna be like that!

bman-  Just kidding about the Bruins; I did get your attention.  Their fate is sealed by aging star veterans at the end of contracts. Tampa skirted rules two years ago to have Kucherov play, plus guys they picked up on his salary, holding him out until the playoffs though he was well.  Should have lost [and were outplayed by Islanders].  So its Rangers all the way OR Avalanche if NY's line ends here

@drtannin 2 posted:

bman-  Just kidding about the Bruins; I did get your attention.  Their fate is sealed by aging star veterans at the end of contracts. Tampa skirted rules two years ago to have Kucherov play, plus guys they picked up on his salary, holding him out until the playoffs though he was well.  Should have lost [and were outplayed by Islanders].  So its Rangers all the way OR Avalanche if NY's line ends here

Tampa used the rules is more accurate, isn’t it? Teams have shuffled players in and out of the lineup since the hard cap was introduced. Kind of like taking tax breaks when allowed.

@haggis posted:

It depends on the nature of the work.  My daughter and son-in-law both work for consulting companies and have worked largely at home for several years, even before COVID.  When they did work away from home, it was to travel to clients, not to go to the office.  In fact, neither has an office as such; rather, there are shared workplaces in the building that they can use if in-person interactions are needed or preferred.  On the other hand, those of us in academia, the sciences, engineering, etc. strongly value in-person interactions, meetings, etc. for just the reasons you state (not just "random," thought, but with intention).  So, there is no right or wrong.  Here is a link to a podcast (with further links to the original article) from a recent study in Nature.

Thanks for the link...

@winetarelli posted:

For the record, for anyone else… I tested negative on a rapid at home-antigen test. But I just had a gut feeling, even though the symptoms weren’t too bad, so I went and got the official PCR test, which was positive. My point is, if you think you might have it, don’t rely on at-home testing as definitive.

Sorry to hear…but a question, I presume you are vaccinated and boosted…why would you have to take Paxlovid?

Have a speedy recovery.

@billhike posted:

Tampa used the rules is more accurate, isn’t it? Teams have shuffled players in and out of the lineup since the hard cap was introduced. Kind of like taking tax breaks when allowed.

Yes, but in 2020-21, the exemption they got for Kucherov's salary cap was in the regular season, that allowed them to replace him with two starters of equivalent total salaries. Kucherov was purposefully held out for at least 1 month of the regular season, then brought back in playoffs [via loophole that allowed Kucherov to play too ven if team way over cap]. Without Kucherov [and those other players] in playoffs, they likely would not have beaten the Islanders.  It's spilt milk, yes, and the rules have been revised to prevent this from happening again. But maybe reverse fortune will come to TB.   Even though they lost their 3rd best player in Edmonton series [Kadri], I'm hoping the Colorado Avalanche hoist the cup in 2021-2022. After the 1st week of the season, COL had the best record in NHL, best balance O/D/G, and it wasn't particularly close.

Last edited by drtannin 2
@winetarelli posted:

For the record, for anyone else… I tested negative on a rapid at home-antigen test. But I just had a gut feeling, even though the symptoms weren’t too bad, so I went and got the official PCR test, which was positive. My point is, if you think you might have it, don’t rely on at-home testing as definitive.

Only partly agree.  More specifically, the home rapid spike protein Antigen test is less sensitive- ie needs higher titers to read positive.  You could run out and get an expensive gene amplification PCR and  waste time, money and resources, or wait 24-48 hrs and repeat the home test, which inevitably is positive after 2 day incubation. As stated in the NEJM, both choices are effective, and unless clearly immunocompromised and unvaccinated where there is large risk in waiting, or have a vital work or other obligation that can't wait that time,  the latter is wiser and less resource costly.  Remember, if you think you have it and are not dying, diagnosis is safely presumed, behavior is quarantine at home, and treatment is supportive stay at home.  If you have influenza, adenovirus or rhinovirus, behavior and treatment is the same.  I've posted NEJM AMA recommendations below

Rapid Diagnostic Testing for SARS-CoV-2

List of authors.

  • Paul K. Drain, M.D., M.P.H.
  • January 20, 2022
    N Engl J Med 2022; 386:264-272
    DOI: 10.1056/NEJMcp2117115

KEY CLINICAL POINTS

Rapid Diagnostic Testing for SARS-CoV-2

  • Rapid diagnostic tests (RDTs) that are authorized by the Food and Drug Administration to diagnose severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) infection are either nucleic acid amplification tests to detect genes or antigen-based immunoassays to detect proteins of SARS-CoV-2.

  • RDTs are approved for use in persons with symptoms of coronavirus disease 2019 (Covid-19) and in asymptomatic persons who are close contacts of a person with Covid-19 or who have been in a potential high-risk transmission setting.

  • Symptomatic persons should undergo testing as soon as possible, quarantine while awaiting test results, and consider retesting if they have a negative RDT, particularly if they have a high pretest probability of infection.

  • Asymptomatic persons with a known exposure to SARS-CoV-2 should undergo testing 5 to 7 days after exposure, and if the RDT is negative, they should undergo testing again 2 days later.

  • Persons with a known exposure to SARS-CoV-2 who are not fully vaccinated should quarantine while awaiting test results, and persons who test positive should isolate, contact a health care provider or public health department, and inform close contacts about the infection.

@napacat posted:

Why are we even testing anymore at this point?  If it is going to be endemic...then what is the point?  And it seems to be getting milder with each variant.

I’ll answer for myself. If I suspect or know I’ve been exposed to someone who has tested positive, I want to ensure I don’t pass it along to my 86 year old mother, who I bring groceries to and visit every week and a half. She still prefers living in her house despite failing eyesight and not being able to drive herself. It’s an hour and a half each way, or I’d see her more often. While there are other people who can help out occasionally, she’s my mother. While vaccinated  and boosted, she is elderly with some other moderate health conditions. I’d be quite upset if I infected her with Covid, or even the flu.

There are multiple cancer survivors at my job. I sometimes come in close contact with them. That should be enough explanation there. Also some front-office coworkers have elderly parents they help care for, and some have children with asthma and other health conditions. If I think I’m sick or contagious, I’ll avoid contact with them as much as possible. An outbreak at work could lead to skilled machinists missing work, which negatively affects our business and that of our customers.

I have access to convenient testing. I care about the collective health and we’ll-being of my friends, family and community. A “milder variant” doesn’t affect everyone the same. So while I’m not always completely vigilant, I’m doing my best to live “normally” while expending a minuscule amount of extra effort to not infect people who may not be as healthy as I am. I’ve had at least four known close exposures to infected persons, some of whom had moderate symptoms including difficulty breathing. One was bedridden for a week. Our CEO, who is athletic and otherwise quite healthy, is still having some lung issues from his bout a year and a half ago. I’m very comfortable with my actions and decisions, no matter what anyone else thinks.

Last edited by billhike
@napacat posted:

Why are we even testing anymore at this point?  If it is going to be endemic...then what is the point?  And it seems to be getting milder with each variant.

I don’t know the science, and would defer to dr. Tannin.  But, the past is not always prologue.

The “mildness” may relate to the vaccinations and boosters. I have a friend who just had a 10 day trial postponed because 3 or the 4 lawyers have tested positive.  One has shortness of breath and other symptoms.  One is a cancer patient with suppressed immunity and one takes care of her elderly parents.

Last edited by irwin
@billhike posted:

I’ll answer for myself. If I suspect or know I’ve been exposed to someone who has tested positive, I want to ensure I don’t pass it along to my 86 year old mother, who I bring groceries to and visit every week and a half. She still prefers living in her house despite failing eyesight and not being able to drive herself. It’s an hour and a half each way, or I’d see her more often. While there are other people who can help out occasionally, she’s my mother. While vaccinated  and boosted, she is elderly with some other moderate health conditions. I’d be quite upset if I infected her with Covid, or even the flu.

There are multiple cancer survivors at my job. I sometimes come in close contact with them. That should be enough explanation there. Also some front-office coworkers have elderly parents they help care for, and some have children with asthma and other health conditions. If I think I’m sick or contagious, I’ll avoid contact with them as much as possible. An outbreak at work could lead to skilled machinists missing work, which negatively affects our business and that of our customers.

I have access to convenient testing. I care about the collective health and we’ll-being of my friends, family and community. A “milder variant” doesn’t affect everyone the same. So while I’m not always completely vigilant, I’m doing my best to live “normally” while expending a minuscule amount of extra effort to not infect people who may not be as healthy as I am. I’ve had at least four known close exposures to infected persons, some of whom had moderate symptoms including difficulty breathing. One was bedridden for a week. Our CEO, who is athletic and otherwise quite healthy, is still having some lung issues from his bout a year and a half ago. I’m very comfortable with my actions and decisions, no matter what anyone else thinks.

+1 on this, I just found out this morning someone I am supposed to golf with tonight was in close contact with another that tested positive yesterday.  I am traveling through 4 states for work in the next 4 days, and by removing contact with this person, as remote as the chances may be, I'm trying to keep from infecting myself and spreading to others. 

My Trump-supporting, anti-vax brother-in-law is now paying the price for his beliefs. He's been sicker than a dog for the past week or so, but is now too embarrassed to go to a doctor & admit it. He attended some function where nearly all of them came down with it. Unfortunately, no one else in his family got the shot, either. He also can't continue his weekly visits to his ailing mother (my mother-in-law), as she has so many preconditions, that even though vaxed, she'd more than likely not survive.  My wife (his sister) is so pissed at him.

@mneeley490 posted:

My Trump-supporting, anti-vax brother-in-law is now paying the price for his beliefs. He's been sicker than a dog for the past week or so, but is now too embarrassed to go to a doctor & admit it. He attended some function where nearly all of them came down with it. Unfortunately, no one else in his family got the shot, either. He also can't continue his weekly visits to his ailing mother (my mother-in-law), as she has so many preconditions, that even though vaxed, she'd more than likely not survive.  My wife (his sister) is so pissed at him.

Can't count the number of times people have told a story like this:  friend or relative is a Trumpanzee who was proud and loud about not getting the shot, then got sick.  Most others though then got treated at least.

@karen983 posted:

I had covid 8 months ago, but I still suffer from some negative consequences. I have high blood pressure, weakness sometimes and insomnia.

A lot is still unknown, but high blood pressure and insomnia are not reported related. Weakness is, and is common, like chronic fatigue syndrome.  Unfortunately, no treatments are available for long COVID.  Meds are only to help with symptoms.

My younger son got it a few days ago at summer camp.  Symptoms aren't too bad, but he lost his sense of taste.

At this point, I am the only one in my immediate family who hasn't been diagnosed with Covid at some point.  Is it really possible I am the "last man standing" or I wonder if I got it but was one of the lucky asymptomatic people.

Although I am the only one in the family who got all 4 jabs.  Maybe this vaccine thingie works??

Rothko, I got all 4 jabs and I'm pretty sure I picked it up on one of my 4 trips during May.  Didn't even realize it for a while.  Then my very mild cold like symptoms slowly started and ramped up over 7 days.  By the time I realized I might have it I was already past it.  But thinking about it in retrospect I do believe I had it.

The latest Omicron variants are just now kicking into high gear.  Stay vigilant but be ready.  The odds are against you sorry to say.

my order of symptoms are,

mild itchy throat, a light cough for 1 day, then i started getting bad GI issues, then on day 2 my bones started getting achy so i grabbed the rapid test.  It was very light but tstill distinct, so i grabbed a second one and same result.

i am super dehydrated right now and my gout got triggered so that kinda sucks

I know this is anecdotal but I know of at least six people that have gotten COVID in this last six weeks and the one thing I can think of they all have in common was they travelled right before or when they caught it.  All six.  Flying versus driving didn't matter.

American Airlines CEO Doug Parker: "I concur, the aircraft is the safest place you can be."

i mean who woulda thought that sitting in a metal can with 300 other people packed together would be the safest place against corona.

I caught it - no traveling though.  Boosters work - Stef had a second booster and I did not because they refused to give it to me as I was then 2 weeks under 50 and I was not able to get one since we got back from the trip due to my trial schedule etc.   Well my symptoms, while not bad, were worse than hers and lasted longer which is the opposite of how our immune systems usually work

@jcocktosten posted:

I caught it - no traveling though.  Boosters work - Stef had a second booster and I did not because they refused to give it to me as I was then 2 weeks under 50 and I was not able to get one since we got back from the trip due to my trial schedule etc.   Well my symptoms, while not bad, were worse than hers and lasted longer which is the opposite of how our immune systems usually work

i mean .. you did just hit 50 =P

So far as I know, I haven't gotten it yet.  Of course, you can get COVID and be asymptomatic, so it's hard to know.  I still wear a mask at grocery stores, and, of course, on airplanes and at airports.   A couple lawyers I know got it recently, were symptomatic, and had to postpone trials.  The newest strain is quite transmissible, apparently.

It's confusing. We started with Greek letters. Then we have BA.1, BA.2, etc. Why not keep using Greek letters? Why BA instead of CD or EF?

@irwin posted:

So far as I know, I haven't gotten it yet.  Of course, you can get COVID and be asymptomatic, so it's hard to know.  I still wear a mask at grocery stores, and, of course, on airplanes and at airports.   A couple lawyers I know got it recently, were symptomatic, and had to postpone trials.  The newest strain is quite transmissible, apparently.

It's confusing. We started with Greek letters. Then we have BA.1, BA.2, etc. Why not keep using Greek letters? Why BA instead of CD or EF?

apparently there's some sense in the madness.  The strain family depends on the genetic marker they're using to track.

Ba.1 Ba.2 have the same genetic tracking marker but have mutations elsewhere.

So i'm getting over it a little right now, just to list out my symptoms for those mildly curious:

mild itchy throat, a light cough for 1 day, then i started getting bad GI issues, then on day 2 my bones started getting achy so i grabbed the rapid test.  It was very light but tstill distinct, so i grabbed a second one and same result.

Day 1 light cough, itchy throat, i thought nothing of it, had GI issues develop at night

Day 2 really bad GI issues, bones and joints got really achy.  Night time was alot of cold sweats and a terrible headache

Day 3 was the worst, bed ridden, terrible headaches, constant hot and cold body temp change, coughing, chest pains

Day 4 Still have headaches and night sweats but no more GI issues, coughing and sneezing

Day 5 head is very clogged, mild coughing, occassional sneezing, able to properly sleep without the cold sweats.  Still taking advil for the headaches.

so it feels like i'm on the mend thankfully.  Will take a rapid test probably in 2 days to see if i'm still testing positive.

@g-man posted:

So i'm getting over it a little right now, just to list out my symptoms for those mildly curious:

mild itchy throat, a light cough for 1 day, then i started getting bad GI issues, then on day 2 my bones started getting achy so i grabbed the rapid test.  It was very light but tstill distinct, so i grabbed a second one and same result.

Day 1 light cough, itchy throat, i thought nothing of it, had GI issues develop at night

Day 2 really bad GI issues, bones and joints got really achy.  Night time was alot of cold sweats and a terrible headache

Day 3 was the worst, bed ridden, terrible headaches, constant hot and cold body temp change, coughing, chest pains

Day 4 Still have headaches and night sweats but no more GI issues, coughing and sneezing

Day 5 head is very clogged, mild coughing, occassional sneezing, able to properly sleep without the cold sweats.  Still taking advil for the headaches.

so it feels like i'm on the mend thankfully.  Will take a rapid test probably in 2 days to see if i'm still testing positive.

Sorry to read you had such a rough go of it. I had moderate cold symptoms — mostly similar to bronchitis with post nasal drip and some sinus soreness — tested negative at-home but positive at the PCR doctor. Began Paxlovid 40 hours after 1st symptoms, symptoms lasted 3 more days and after that it was just a coughing fit at night which got progressively more mild every night for 2 weeks.

Everyone in my family got it, looking back my wife probably first last weekend. she had massive GI issues and then fatigue so we thought it was food poisoning at first. Then my 12 year old on Monday came home with a migraine. Monday night I woke up in the middle of the night with my arm throbbing where I had all my vaccines (last one was in January) and feeling like I just got hit by a truck. Rapid tests for everyone and we all had it. Seven year old never had symptoms, my wife still can barely keep her eyes open but is otherwise fine once the GI cleared up after about 24 hours, 12 year old slept for a day and now has a cough but felt fine from Wednesday onwards. For me Monday and Tuesday we're rough, massive body aches and fatigue, then my chest felt like I just did a run in -40 dry cold. Constant burning and short of breath, but otherwise getting better. That's still there but lessening daily. Now I feel almost back to normal with a moderately tight chest but the kicker is yesterday afternoon over the course of about 5 hours I completely lost my sense of smell. Zero left. Can open a jar of coffee, take a huge wiff and can't smell a thing. Can identify sweet, bitter, sour, salty but can't taste beyond that.

Everyone in my family got it, looking back my wife probably first last weekend. she had massive GI issues and then fatigue so we thought it was food poisoning at first. Then my 12 year old on Monday came home with a migraine. Monday night I woke up in the middle of the night with my arm throbbing where I had all my vaccines (last one was in January) and feeling like I just got hit by a truck. Rapid tests for everyone and we all had it. Seven year old never had symptoms, my wife still can barely keep her eyes open but is otherwise fine once the GI cleared up after about 24 hours, 12 year old slept for a day and now has a cough but felt fine from Wednesday onwards. For me Monday and Tuesday we're rough, massive body aches and fatigue, then my chest felt like I just did a run in -40 dry cold. Constant burning and short of breath, but otherwise getting better. That's still there but lessening daily. Now I feel almost back to normal with a moderately tight chest but the kicker is yesterday afternoon over the course of about 5 hours I completely lost my sense of smell. Zero left. Can open a jar of coffee, take a huge wiff and can't smell a thing. Can identify sweet, bitter, sour, salty but can't taste beyond that.

I'm on day 6 with allergy like symptoms, sneezing itching throat but all in all on the mend.

I can't smell chlorine for some reason, taste is still fine. (trying to sort out the pool water)

The title of the article implies that you could get Covid every 4 weeks from now on.  That's not what the article says.  What it says is that the new strain, Omicron BA.5 has shown a strong ability to overcome people who were previously vaccinated or even had the earlier strain of Omicron BA2.  But NOT that you will keep getting Omicron BA.5 infections every month from here on out.

It's a bad strain, definitely.  It's almost like a new disease again, in the sense that it is going to cut through a huge swath of our population.  But the prior immunity from vaccines and/or prior infections appears to weaken the effects of the BA.5 strain, so yes, you are going to get sick, but no, you probably aren't going to go the hospital or die from it.

Had to mutually agree to reschedule having beverages outdoors with a good friend of mine, due to his middle and elementary school age daughters both having COVID now.  He says they’re both vaxxed and boosted, so only mild to nonexistent symptoms thankfully.  

Wish I didn’t have to say it, but it’s still around……. 😬

@billhike posted:

Where were you when the previous administration said it would disappear with warm weather? Or talked about the Mexican-financed wall and tariffs that China was paying?

Those were some of the 30,000+ lies he told, not gaffes.

Lies are not a problem, just gaffes.

Try to keep up!

Meanwhile, here are some of the latest!

https://www.politifact.com/fac...ump&ruling=false

Last edited by bman

2 weeks ago for me. No reaction nor soreness. I have heard but can't confirm that 1- the flu will be more virulent than usual and am unsure of the vax coverage for what would become the major circulating strain in my area; 2- getting flu and covid shots concurrently has a higher rate of reported reactions; and 3- know that 3- 6 weeks before peak flu season is optimal for flu shot [eg early to mid November allows peak Ab by Christmas holidays]. Since timing less critical for covid [ since have higher more recent Ab from 4 prior shots and omicron infection], and no flu infection in at least 3 years, I have opted for covid shot now, and flu shot in a couple of weeks. That's my rationale, but then again I talk my way into stuff too much LOL

@jcocktosten posted:

Had both new covid shot and flu shot Sunday.  After 4 modernas, this was my first Pfizer.  I was quite tired and did not feel particularly well the next day and expected sore arm.  Never had a reaction other than sore arm to Moderna

I was exactly the opposite, no issues with pfizer, first time getting the moderna, my tonsils and lymph nodes were super swollen for a week.

I got the Pfizer booster (2nd one/newest one) and flu shot last Saturday.  Sore arm from Covid booster, Saturday night I had fever and chills, headache and body ache, woke up extremely tired Sunday morning.  Took Motrin and lots of water and was fine rest of the day and normal Monday morning after a good rest Sunday night.

In hindsight if I had something going on I would space out the shots;  we skipped an OT Cavs win Sunday night because I wasn't up to it.  But if you have the weekend or few days to recover I would get them both at same time.

Last edited by patespo1

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