We were invited by a friend-couple yesterday, both of them are working in the hotel industry. This sometimes gives them great occasions for private wine-buying:
We had an exceptional Malbec Estrella Lujan 1977 from Weinert. This wine caught a rating of 19/20 P. in our leading wine-mag "vinum", so we were really anxious to this bottle:
This wine was in the big wood cask until 1998! Harmonious acidity and alluring sweetness on the palate,plum and cedarwood flavours, incredibly deep and smoky ultralong finish. Crazy, unusal wine, not comparable with any other Malbec I've ever tasted. I'd rate it at 92 P.

[ 06-07-2002, 08:28 AM: Message edited by: Marc ]

I'm guessing this is a very rare wine, so probably not available (or easily found at least) over here. Too bad Jan Luthman has vanished off the face of the earth, he loves malbec. So does another regular here, whose names escapes me at the moment....

would that be......moi?

Saw the post, haven't responded as to the unlikelihood of any mere mortal ever seeing this wine. Also, only other Bodegas Weinert experience was a complete downer. I'd be interested in 'finding' this for a taste somewhere, though...

bman and kybo,
this is a very rare wine indeed. You could buy it until recently at one or two high-end retailers here for around USD 70. Our friends payed about half of that price. It seems strange though, that it is nowhere to find in your places, since you're closer to Argentina and import much more of their wines.

kybo: I would love to try a great malbec but we get so little of any malbec here. If they're not sending the stuff here, nor to Europe, where is it going? We get only the wretched Etchart (though their torontes is good), and a couple of others, one of which is pretty $$$$$.

Just for the rare Malbec-Lovers here (according to a recent posting): We finished the last bottle of this beauty yesterday and it was absolutely fantastic, alluring sweet, smoky, finegrained plummy and yummie like an aristocratic bordeaux! I would maybe rate that one classic. Everyone who ever has the chance to try this wine will never speak again of Malbec as an inferior variety!

Marc,

I am also a fan of Malbec wines. Kybo introduced this very alluring grape to me a few months back. If you can find it in your neck of the woods, try the 2000 Tikal 'Amorio' malbec from Argentina. It is truly a wonderful example of how some of the really good malbecs are made today. The downside to this wine is that the annual case production is under 500 cases. Kybo and I bought some for $US35 per bottle. WS rates it 91 pts. I wish I was lucky enough to try a 25 year old bottle of malbec. Good luck finding the Tikal.

IW

Italian wino,
It is astonishing that you can't find the Weinert Malbec Estrella 1977 in the USA. The last tranche of this wine has left the winery only two years ago. I could still buy it in Switzerland for around USD 75 and I'm really tempted to do so. Thanks for the Tikal-tip, I'd like to try that when I run into it.

[ 07-04-2002, 04:23 AM: Message edited by: Marc ]

I KNEW I’d find Kybo on this thread! And Bman, I’m still around – just a trifle pressed for time at the moment.
Marc: I’d never even heard of Weinert’s Estrella Lujan before. Eleven years in cask!! Unbelievable.
I’ve just been reading some other notes on the stuff – sounds about as close to Nirvana as I’m likely to get. Amazingly, it is available over here, but at £1,000 ($1,500) per case of 12. Sadly, however glorious the juice, that’s a price that’s hard to justify in these straitened times – I’ll just dream on a while.
You're a lucky man, Marc.

Just adjusted my brain - not eleven years in cask - twenty-one years!!!

Words fail me............

Hey Jan,
maybe you're able to get just one bottle somewhere, I promise you it's worth it! That would be a sure closet drinking wine then, because it is too great to share with anybody

Here is a discussion about Malbec I started a month or so ago...

http://web8.winespectator.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=2;t=001855

Many thanks for that, Brent – delighted to meet another Malbec devotee. Yup, oak-smoky BBQ spare ribs would be just perfect.

Malbec does pop up in Forum conversations from time to time – sorry to have missed your thread (we were away most of May).

I’m still fantasising about Marc’s 1977 Estrella but, descending a moment from those Elysian heights, there is a much more modestly priced, and almost equally rare, Argentinian Malbec that you might like to try and track down – even if only for the curiosity value. “Cadus”, made by Nieto Senetiner.

According to the blurb I’ve read, Senetiner’s consultant is Alberto Antonini, a protégé of Tachis and an ex-winemaker at Antinori. Senetiner’s malbec vines are allegedly over eighty years old. I tried a bottle of the 1997 Cadus earlier this year - on opening, the wine was very tight and the nose very closed: just another OK toasty-smoky-oaky Argentina Malbec.

But, after the JVH Luthman patented process of drinking one small glass then recorking bottle and leaving for 24 hours in a cool dark corner under the stairs in the north-east corner of the house, it turned into something just stunning. Dark purple, almost black in colour: lovely glutinous sheets of glycerin; wonderfuI nose and palate of black currant/black cherry, with gorgeous vanilla, spices, toasted smoky oak, and a thread of acidity/wild berry flavors running though the whole thing.

Wine-searcher.com only lists three stockists in the world outside Argentina – the nearest to you is way up in bman territory in Quebec. I suspect half my pleasure in discovering this wine was that one of the three global stockists is an eccentric little merchant in the town of Sanderstead, a few miles up the single-track rail line from our village.

Senetiner’s website does list a US agent, although I don’t know how up to date the information is:
LEONARD KREUSCH, 200 LE GRAND AVE., NORTHVALE, N.J. 07647-2406 Telephone: 1-201-7842500 Fax: 1-201-7840951 Contact: ROLF O. THEUERKAUF

There’s an interesting write-up on Argentinian wine producers (including Senetiner) at:
http://www.wineaccessmag.com/LifewiseWineAccess1999/nov_arg2.html

Happy hunting!

To continue the Malbec finds... I stumbled across a 99 Yacochuya Malbec, RP 91, and took an immediate liking to it's chocately goodness. I grabbed a few more bottles to cellar. Very interesting grape, I hope to seek out some more Argentinian Malbecs.

Jan, I also tasted the Cadus a year ago or so at a tasting and I liked it! It is probably a litte overpaid, but it is still a nicely concentrated earthy Malbec with quite a bit of elegance.

Ok, guys, here comes a contrarian opinion!

I love Malbec but I did not have a high opinion of the Weinert Malbec 1977 Estrella. Estrella, which means "star", is added to the Weinert label only on bottles coming from the best barrels in a great vintage year. I had this wine at one of the top Argentinean beef restaurants about a year ago. It was like $75 at the restaurant list. It had to compete with 1997 Angelica Catena Zapata Malbec and 1997 Angel Mendoza "Pura Sangre" Malbec. The latter two were around $35 and $20. The Weinert came in last and was the only bottle we did not finish! My notes said: highly oxidized; made in the old Argentinean style (big barrels), velvety and supple but the fruit is hidden below the acidity. Was this an off-bottle? Could be and after hearing other people rave about this wine, I am willing to give it a second shot ... but I think that the disagreement here is about "style."

If you like big, ripe fruity wines, this Malbec Estrella will disappoint you. It is made in a sort of old Rioja style ... that's the best comparison.

Having said this, I do love the 1994 Cavas de Weinert (Estrella), which is a blend of Cab S, Malbec and Merlot. Unfortunately, the winemaker who made the 1994 does no longer work for Weinert. I doubt that he was behind the 1977 Malbec. The Cavas has consistently been better than the varietal wines, year after year.

Cheers,
Gus

And in the original spirit of the thread, I forgot to say that my best Malbec ever was Achaval Ferrer 1999 Gran Malbec, closely followed by Laura Catena's "1999 Luca Malbec."

Gus

Oh well, nobody is around ... I'll keep talking to myself

Marc: Does the label say just "Lujan" or "Lujan de Cuyo"? Only the latter makes sense to me.

Also, Parker reviewed this wine in August 1992 (WA issue #82) and gave it 94 pts. His description, however, is very different from mine ... which keeps me wondering whether I have had an off-bottle ... could be.

Nevertheless, this wine was bottled 10 years ago. It was probably further aged in bottle (not in cask) at the winery before being released again, just a couple of years ago.

According to wine-searcher.com, the wine is available for $80-90 in Canada at The Wine Cottage (Calgary) and British Columbia Liquor.

Gus

gusgus,
you're right, it's "Lujan de Cuyo". I think you really had a bad bottle, then! Your description does not fit with my three experiences with this wine. However there is bottle variation (not astonishing with such an old wine) and my rating vary between 90 and 95P.
Your comparison is not bad however, it has some similarities with great old 1964-Riojas, or with earthy Lafitte.
As far as I read, there were several bottlings maybe the first already 10 years ago, the last dates only 2-3 year back.

[ 07-07-2002, 06:47 AM: Message edited by: Marc ]

Hi Marc,

I will be in Argentina late in July and prompted by this thread, I did some due diligence last night and have already found a shop where they sell the 1977 Malbec Estrella for A$70, which now is less than US$20! So, I will buy whatever they have, try it, and report back ... I had given up on this wine, but restaurants in Argentina are well known for storing wine right next to the barbecue grill! (I'm kidding, but I suspect that my bottle may have been improperly stored).

I am glad to hear that you like my comparison with great old Rioja. This Malbec is definitely not done in the fruit forward, oaky, fruit bomb style that has become so popular. I am not a big fan of old-style Rioja but I have had a few that were wonderful and delicious (1978 Castillo Ygay comes to mind).

Gus

Marc,

I found this link, where the wine is described as bottled in 1998:

http://www.bodegaweinert.com/ingles/wines/weinsortiment.htm

On the right column, find "Special Wines", and then Estrella 1977.
They give a whole description of the wine. They say that the information on the wine corresponds to the blend done in the 2000 release (they are releasing it in batches apparently) ... Hmm, "blend" ... sounds like there may be bits of Cab S and merlot in the wine??

They also say that the next release of "Estrella" will be for the 1994 harvest.

Gus

So, Guscus, Estrella is priced at $1,500.00 per case of twelve in the UK, but can be bought over the counter in Argentina at less than $20 a bottle.
I’m still trying to work out whether that makes it any less magical. Or whether my wife and I should go on holiday to Argentina, buy six cases, come home, keep one, sell five, then do it again, and again, and again - all through the British winter........

What a wonderful dream.

You got any tips on "Where?" In Argentina?

By the way, is Laura Catena not the sister of Ernesto of Tikal Amorio fame? What a phenomenal family. Sadly, as far as I can find out, neither Ernesto nor Laura yet export to the UK. Did you taste your Achal Ferrer Gran Malbec and Luca Malbec in Argentina?

Lucky old you.

Marc – v impressed that you came across Cadus at a tasting. I’d agree with your view on the pricing. It lists at around £17 ($25) over here - that's a lot less than Catena Alta or Lapostolle's ‘Clos Apalta’, but there’s still a lot of good 90+ competition available at that kind of price in the UK. Strange how the cadus seemed to taste like a Malbec made by an Italian – or maybe I’m just easily influenced by the blurb.

Jan,

Malbec Estrella 1977 at La-Barrica on-line shop for $69.90 pesos argentinos or roughly $US20:

1. go to www.la-barrica.com />2. on the left bar where "Buscador" (Finder) is, choose from the roll menu: "Vino Tintos" on the top and "Mayor a $50" on the bottom. Then, click "Ir".
3. Voila: Weinert Estrella 1977 should be in the list, together with other Catena-Zapatas beauties from 1991, 1993, 1994 and 1995.

I sent them email to check how many bottles they have. Not sure how accurate their on-line inventory is ...

Laura is Ernesto's sister, correct. Tikal and Luca are imported into the US by Vine Connections in California. The wines carry the names of their children. The Lucas are $35 (Malbec) and $45 (Cab S); 1999 Luca Cab S kicks butt ... better than 1999 Caymus SS and Phelps Insignia IMHO.

Yes, I tried the Achaval Ferrer 1999 Gran Malbec in Buenos Aires last year. Brought 3 bottles with me ... but at the time, it was retailing for US$75 (worth the money really). I am hoping to find some bottles at 100-120 pesos when I go there ... inflation has been 40-50% but 1 dollar=3.5 pesos now ... I'm told.

Cadus: this wine has been missing me and it is hard to find in the US. I hope to get it soon ...

Clos Apalta: yeah, baby! This is truly the only one Chilean wine (the 1997) that had me raving for days ... the best Chilean stuff is coming from Apalta indeed. I have a couple of 1997 and two 1999 in the cellar. They retail for $50 in the US. I bought the 1997 in Santiago last year on a friend's recommendation.

Gus

Sorry for reviving this old thread but I just wanted to say that I went to Argentina, retasted the Weinert Estrella Malbec 1977 ... and it is an awesome wine! Brought back with me 6 botlles. Ended up paying around $25 (US). This wine is still amazingly fruity and luscious. The one bottle I had before was probably in bad shape. Apologies to those who rightly defended this wine. It is a mid 90s pt wine. Never would have thought Malbec will shine this brightly.

Humm..very interesting..if anyone is interested in a bottle of the '77 WEINERT STAR MALBEC let me know...A case is avaible at $150 a bottle...I know that guscus picked them up for $25 but this is the price that I have seen at a NYC shop....Not sure if I should pick up a bottle to taste...what do you think?