quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:
Keeno, some very good points.

In my opinion, the AIG thing had to happen. If AIG had to put it's 1.2 trillion assets on the market, not only would it have been a free fall with those assets value, but ALL other assets would have fallen in value. If 25% of the homes on your block are selling at 50% below value, what is your house worth?

At least now, their assets can be sold in a systematic way only as required, and without panic.

It's like a dam of fresh water. Normal circumstances you drink the water and it orderly gets released. The dam doesn't drain too fast and gets replenished over time.
If the dam collapses, all that water comes out at once, the day after no one gets any water to drink and you probably just flooded all of the cities down stream.

The thing that bugs me most though, is that people are still talking about Sarah Palin's hair due, and cnn has a report today on how looks affects voting ... Oh Gawd, "there goes my life savings, but at least I can look like sarah palin"

quote:

Originally posted by g-man:


The thing that bugs me most though, is that people are still talking about Sarah Palin's hair due, and cnn has a report today on how looks affects voting ... Oh Gawd, "there goes my life savings, but at least I can look like sarah palin"

I would expect nothing less from CNN.

quote:

Originally posted by g-man:
Oh Gawd, "there goes my life savings, but at least I can look like sarah palin"

My daily paper seems to have an article a day about her glasses.

We walked, or more properly got dragged to the edge of the abyss by the banking system. At the last moment the Fed pulled us all back. We are not turned around and running away from it, but at least for now we are not going in either.

Should the government be involved in private enterprise, or bail out Wall St, hell no -- under normal circumstances. This was far from normal however, we were this close to the total collapse of the banking system. It would have been chaos, and a very long and painful recovery.

One other note, who among you thought that after trading ended on Wednesday it was a great time to buy, especially financials?

If any individual was buying financial stocks on Wednesday, they're lying.

quote:

Originally posted by VT2IT:
We walked, or more properly got dragged to the edge of the abyss by the banking system. At the last moment the Fed pulled us all back. We are not turned around and running away from it, but at least for now we are not going in either.

Should the government be involved in private enterprise, or bail out Wall St, hell no -- under normal circumstances. This was far from normal however, we were this close to the total collapse of the banking system. It would have been chaos, and a very long and painful recovery.

One other note, who among you thought that after trading ended on Wednesday it was a great time to buy, especially financials?

If I felt like losing any more money in something that we have no control over... Vegas at least will give me comps =)

quote:

Originally posted by DoubleD:
If any individual was buying financial stocks on Wednesday, they're lying.

But its really easy to lighten up on some positions this morning.

Short selling is stopped by the Feds.

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/19/news/economy/sec_short_selling/index.htm

quote:

Originally posted by DoubleD:
If any individual was buying financial stocks on Wednesday, they're lying.

Well somebody had to be, for every seller there must be a buyer. Unfortunatly it was not I.

quote:

Originally posted by g-man:

quote:

Originally posted by VT2IT:

One of the biggest problems now is the requirement to mark to market, more governmental interference which came about because of the Enron debacle. In overly simplified terms; even if only one of those 10 hypothetical loans went bad the bank has to mark them all down.

One good thing which has come out of this mess is that I am spending more time then usual watching CNBC, ah more Erin Burnett.

transparency is always a good thing ... we mark to market all things in life all the time, why would banks that we invest in not have to do the same?

Well the mark to market rules are no more. G-man may not agree with me but Hank Paulson does. As for the stopping short selling, that's just stupid. What do they think will happen when the restriction is lifted? Why don't they just reinstate the uptick rule?

Yet 1.2 trillion more lost today in the market.

Don't worry, the government will take care of everything.

quote:

Originally posted by cdr:
Don't worry, the government will take care of everything.

Socialism will be the death of America, and I'm serious.

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:

quote:

Originally posted by cdr:
Don't worry, the government will take care of everything.

Socialism will be the death of America, and I'm serious.

Oh relax a little...in a year or two everything will be fine.

quote:

Originally posted by dannyk8232:

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:

quote:

Originally posted by cdr:
Don't worry, the government will take care of everything.

Socialism will be the death of America, and I'm serious.

Oh relax a little...in a year or two everything will be fine.

, the tea leaves have been telling us this is the direction for years.

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:

quote:

Originally posted by dannyk8232:

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:

quote:

Originally posted by cdr:
Don't worry, the government will take care of everything.

Socialism will be the death of America, and I'm serious.

Oh relax a little...in a year or two everything will be fine.

, the tea leaves have been telling us this is the direction for years.

Buy Real Estate in St. Kitts...everything will be alright...or if not the view will be Not to mention you would qualify for a St. Kitts passport and be able to travel to Cuba legally to buy lots of good Cigars!

There is no question, we are on "The Road to Serfdom." Is there anyone to turn us back in the direction of freedom? Doubtful. We must lead ourselves. No matter how many once great economies have been ruined, no matter how many wars, no matter how many innocent lives extinguished, there comes along another generation of arrogant, self-anointed busybodies with the audacity to think that socialism is just peachy. It's just that none of the other attempts at socialism were done correctly, and if we put trust in them, they can save us all and create equality once and for all. The sad but true fact is that a society can have freedom, or it can have equality, but it cannot have both, and only freedom will insure the best outcomes for the widest range of people.

quote:

Originally posted by cdr:
There is no question, we are on "The Road to Serfdom." Is there anyone to turn us back in the direction of freedom? Doubtful. We must lead ourselves. No matter how many once great economies have been ruined, no matter how many wars, no matter how many innocent lives extinguished, there comes along another generation of arrogant, self-anointed busybodies with the audacity to think that socialism is just peachy. It's just that none of the other attempts at socialism were done correctly, and if we put trust in them, they can save us all and create equality once and for all. The sad but true fact is that a society can have freedom, or it can have equality, but it cannot have both, and only freedom will insure the best outcomes for the widest range of people.

You equate socialism with far too many things.

Ralph Nader is bad...and so is cdr

Nice try, Chilepepper. You will never convince me that economic freedom and individual liberty are bad or that government is good. However, Ralph Nader's socialist, totalitarian ideas are certainly bad. They have been tried with disastrous consequences all over the world. Again, history is on my side.

No government can decide what is best for me to do with my own money or property. Being an adult is difficult. Making decisions that will not impact us positively for 30 or 40 years down the road are hard to justify when these decisions are in conflict with what we want today. Being responsible for one's own life is challenging, but it is the best way to keep us free. Delaying gratification and saving up 20% or more for a down payment is tough, I mean, there is so much great wine and so many places I want to travel to, etc., etc., etc. Being a responsible citizen means keeping your own house in order. To live a dignified, self-sufficient life and lending a hand to those who are less fortunate and most importantly, not being a burden on your fellow man by urging government to use its coercive power to confiscate the property of another citizen and give it to you.

The market works. It is impartial and does not respect persons or classes (as our government should do as well but has long ago abandoned). Bad behavior or poor performance is punished severely, good behavior and performance is rewarded. It's a beautiful thing. And please do not tell there was "no regulation," because you and I both know that is a lie. This "crisis" is yet another example in a long line of examples and more will certainly occur in the future, of government and individuals engaging in unwise behaviors. It MUST be punished, or it will occur again. As it seems to be going now, we will again opt for security over freedom, and prefer a short term relief for long term pain. How will you all feel when we have a flat stock market for the next decade because of this non-problem solving "solution?"

To all government officials who again, foolishly substituted their own utopian views of how and to whom lenders should do business for the free market's impersonal, risk/reward double-edged sword, you are accountable. To those who bought homes they could not afford, you are accountable. To those refusing to look into the mirror for answers and looking toward Washington, DC, you are accountable. You MUST suffer. You MUST learn that your behavior was dangerous and did not work and ought not be attempted again.

Choose freedom.

quote:

Originally posted by cdr:
Nice try, Chilepepper. You will never convince me that economic freedom and individual liberty are bad or that government is good. However, Ralph Nader's socialist, totalitarian ideas are certainly bad. They have been tried with disastrous consequences all over the world. Again, history is on my side.

According to Civilization 2, 3 and some of 4. Socialism is Clearly the government of choice for us despots that like to have full control =) And since I've always rocked the game, history is clearly not on your side =)

What a week. May we not see such a week again for 20+ years.

The Dow down 818 points for the week, (7.3%) the S&P down 9.5% for the week, and NASDAQ down almost 11% for the WEEK!

I repeat, where in the hell is the bottom!

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:
What a week. May we not see such a week again for 20+ years.

The Dow down 818 points for the week, (7.3%) the S&P down 9.5% for the week, and NASDAQ down almost 11% for the WEEK!

I repeat, where in the hell is the bottom!

Oh my...boy do I wish I knew. We took an overweight position on a stock that keeps going down. We tried to call the bottom.

Also don't have the balls at this point to risk going even more overweight