Manny is one of the best hitters ever. He's currently 10th on the all-time list in OPS+. His rank will likely decline as he tails off in the end of his career. OPS+ is OPS (OBP+SLG) park adjusted and compared to league averages. It's a fairly good tool for comparing hitters across eras. All-time list is Ruth, Williams, Gehrig, and Bonds, for your interest.

Manny is hitting savant. Like many savants, he is totally incompetant out of his element. He's an awful fielder and poor baserunner.

Neil

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Manny is hitting savant. Like many savants, he is totally incompetant out of his element. He's an awful fielder and poor baserunner.

Exactly why I'm glad he didn't get traded to the Marlins. The Marlins already aren't a great defensive team, and he would make it worse. Not to mention, trading Hermida would force someone to switch to RF or play 40 yr old Gonzalez there every day, not to mention creating a big hole in the OF next year when they wouldn't have signed Manny. Could anyone imaging Manny playing the OF in Dolphin stadium? Lotta ground to cover there.

Pitching and a Catcher was the need...and we did pick of Rhodes to fill the need of a left RP. With Josh Johnson and Anibal Sanchez finally coming back from injuries and Volstad seemingly pitching well at the next level...they were smart to stand pat there as they couldn't have improved on them without overpaying with prospects (something a low budget team can't afford).

Still would be nice to pick up a C in August assuming a waiver deal can be done, otherwise, we look to next year and hopefully build upon the success we've had hopefully with a healthy pitching staff.

An outfielder for whom catching a fly ball wasn't a daily adventure????

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Originally posted by Neil K.:
Manny is one of the best hitters ever.
Manny is hitting savant. Like many savants, he is totally incompetant out of his element. He's an awful fielder and poor baserunner.

Neil

I absolutely agree with the first part, but it is the second part why I don't think he is a "lock first ballot" HOF'er.

As for the guys DoubleD brought up:

I don't feel that Yount deserved to be a first ballot guy. Yes he had 3000+ hits and was a two time MVP, but he won only one Gold Glove (at SS), only three All-Star Games, and won only three Silver Sluggers (I think two were at short).

Gwynn - Absolutely. 3000+ hits. 15 A-S games, 5 GG's, 7 SS's, .338 career BA.

Winfield - Yes. 12 A-S games, 3000+ hits, 7 GG's, 6 SS's.

Puckett - Yes, with the caveat that his career was cut short and that he played only 12 seasons. But he averaged more hits per season than anybody in the group, 10 time A-S, 6 GG's, 6 SS's.

Jackson - Absolutely. 14 time A-S, MVP, more HR's than anybody in the group, and second in RBI's to Winfield. 2 SS's. No GG's but a cannon for an arm. And there is the whole "Mr. October" thing....

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Manny is hitting savant. Like many savants, he is totally incompetant out of his element. He's an awful fielder and poor baserunner.

Manny has better career fielding % and stolen base % than Babe Ruth. Having watched him for the last 8 years I can say he's really not that bad in the field most of the time. He has a fairly strong and very accurate arm. I'm not saying he's Ruth offensively either but I guess DnVD and I just disagree on what get's you into Cooperstown the first time around. Easily one of the ten best right handed hitters ever deserves to be in if I had a vote, despite his occasional fielding adventures.

A Jason Bay triple in the 12th leads to the winning run for Boston. Manny never ever would have made it to third, he might not have even gottenm to second as he admired the high fly ball off the monster.

Dom'n'Vin'sDad,

I agree with you...and certainly regarding Reggie (although I couldn't stand him as a player), but Manny is a better hitter than Reggie could ever dream to be...of course he can't field worth a s***. Maybe hasn't been as dramatic as a post season guy, but I don't hold that against someone since Reggie played on a teams in the prime of his career (A's and Yanks) that were WS winning teams, whereas the Indians weren't the best teams with Manny (They weren't the early 70's A's). Remember...you need Pitching to win WS and the Braves and Marlins had the Indians in both 95 and 97 in that area. Reggie didn't play for such an unbalanced team.

[Manny has better career fielding % and stolen base % than Babe Ruth. Having watched him for the last 8 years I can say he's really not that bad in the field most of the time. He has a fairly strong and very accurate arm. [/QUOTE]

Let's not get too carried away with Manny. Hitting savant, yes. Great fielder, strong and very accurate arm, and SBs? Don't think so. Manny played half his career playing short left-field because he had the Monster behind him, making the throws to any base a lot easier.

Thanks for the sense of perspective, DoubleD....

Fielding percentage really doesn't mean that much, unless you use it in terms of total chances. Manny has stolen 35 bases, basically two a year....

Two in a row for the Giants. The best thing is that it means a lunch for me on Friday on my Padre loving colleague....

This Manny Ramirez guy is pretty good.

Circling back on my first Manny post, I was citing OPS but I referred to them as OPS+. Sorry.

To correct: Manny is 10th all time in OPS. He is 25th all-time in OPS+. That all time list runs Ruth, Williams, Bonds, Gehrig, Hornsby....Mays (t20th), Aaron, Dimaggio, Ott, Manny.

Still, one of the best hitters of all time but we'll see what happens when the actual twilight of his career arrives. As Dodger fans know, it's not here yet.

As a comparison, Reggie (who did have a very good arm as I recall) had nearly the same OPS+ when he was Manny's current age. His final numbers puts him 80th on the carreer list.

Sorry for the mix-up.

Neil

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Originally posted by GlennK:
This Manny Ramirez guy is pretty good.

So the Dodgers should sign him to a 4 year deal?

Glad that Manny's out of Beantown.

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Originally posted by DoubleD:

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Originally posted by GlennK:
This Manny Ramirez guy is pretty good.

So the Dodgers should sign him to a 4 year deal?

Glad that Manny's out of Beantown.

No way, not at 36. If I were the Dodgers, I would offer him a big 1 year deal assuming he keeps playing hard the rest of this year. Boras won’t take that though and someone will give him a 4 year deal (Mets/Yankee’s). He really should be just a DH at this point in his career.

As of this moment the Twins are in first place in the american league central!

quote:

Originally posted by GlennK:
This Manny Ramirez guy is pretty good.

Long term, looks like Pittsburg may get the best of this trade as Manny is not likely to stay in LA and although Bay will do well, in Boston, more guys will do well in Pittsburg.
For this season, seems like a win/win/win but that will change over the next few years.

Boras must REALLY be an @@$%&**$#**# to work with.

quote:

Originally posted by Juicy:
Long term, looks like Pittsburg may get the best of this trade as Manny is not likely to stay in LA and although Bay will do well, in Boston, more guys will do well in Pittsburg.
For this season, seems like a win/win/win but that will change over the next few years.

Boras must REALLY be an @@$%&**$#**# to work with.

So Pittsburgh is in a state of perpetual rebuilding, and this trade is a win/win? A win/win trade to me is when it helps you get to the playoffs and if you are a Yankee fan, to win the World Series. Next year around this time, Pittsburgh will trade its two best players for more prospects; and in the year after next, it will trade the Ian Snells and Pat Maholms for more prospects.

Today's series finale should be an interesting one....

Dodgers just imploded yesterday. That 9th inning was ugly....

Woo Hoo!!!!!!!!

D*$#@rs sure look like they miss Saito.....

I hear that Hank has thrown in the towel this year for the Yanks and that's why Byrd slipped down to the Red Sox an waivers. Anyone closer to NYC hear anything like that? Oh happy day!

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Originally posted by Icewino:
I hear that Hank has thrown in the towel this year for the Yanks and that's why Byrd slipped down to the Red Sox an waivers. Anyone closer to NYC hear anything like that? Oh happy day!

I could not believe he already started talking about how good they are going to be next year. What happened to this year? Is the season over already? Kind of sad that he does not even give them a chance. Torre ALWAYS got them to the post season.

Nomar earned his whole salary with one swing last night. Tied for first baby!!

Nice job by the Giants bullpen in Houston....