quote:

Originally posted by Keeno:
I have been on the fence with the Beaucastel and Pegau. Does anyone have any thoughts? Which one would you rather have in your cellar?

Keeno, buy both.

If I was only buying one, it would be Beaucastel without question. I know these wines age well and have a spectacular track record.

quote:

Originally posted by wine+art:

quote:

Originally posted by Keeno:
I have been on the fence with the Beaucastel and Pegau. Does anyone have any thoughts? Which one would you rather have in your cellar?

Keeno, buy both.

If I was only buying one, it would be Beaucastel without question. I know these wines age well and have a spectacular track record.

Thanks for the input.

I'd definitely buy the beaucastel (well...I did buy it actually!) as I think its their best vintage since '01...but to be honest, I regret buying the Pegau before tasting it. After trying it 4 seperate times, I think it's an outstanding wine, but the '04 surpasses it in symmetry, polish & purity of fruit (not to mention value!). The '05 Pegau is austere, crammed w/ tannins & I am not sure if the fruit will ever go toe to toe w/ its rugged backbone...have a feeling it will be more in line w/ the '95 than anything.

quote:

Originally posted by Brad Coelho:
I'd definitely buy the beaucastel (well...I did buy it actually!) as I think its their best vintage since '01...but to be honest, I regret buying the Pegau before tasting it. After trying it 4 seperate times, I think it's an outstanding wine, but the '04 surpasses it in symmetry, polish & purity of fruit (not to mention value!). The '05 Pegau is austere, crammed w/ tannins & I am not sure if the fruit will ever go toe to toe w/ its rugged backbone...have a feeling it will be more in line w/ the '95 than anything.

Brad: Your comments are interesting. I have seen nothing but rave reviews (from various forum/cellar tracker posters) on the '05 Pegau, but something about it is holding me back. The '04 was one of those wines that made me say "wow," and I can get more for less. I just like trying different vintages, but it seems like I am going to be better served by grabbing some '06 and '07 instead.
As wine + art mentioned, Beaucastel has an awesome track record and it appears that, with time, the '05 is going to be really impressive.

quote:

Originally posted by Keeno:

quote:

Originally posted by Brad Coelho:
I'd definitely buy the beaucastel (well...I did buy it actually!) as I think its their best vintage since '01...but to be honest, I regret buying the Pegau before tasting it. After trying it 4 seperate times, I think it's an outstanding wine, but the '04 surpasses it in symmetry, polish & purity of fruit (not to mention value!). The '05 Pegau is austere, crammed w/ tannins & I am not sure if the fruit will ever go toe to toe w/ its rugged backbone...have a feeling it will be more in line w/ the '95 than anything.

Brad: Your comments are interesting. I have seen nothing but rave reviews (from various forum/cellar tracker posters) on the '05 Pegau, but something about it is holding me back. The '04 was one of those wines that made me say "wow," and I can get more for less. I just like trying different vintages, but it seems like I am going to be better served by grabbing some '06 and '07 instead.
As wine + art mentioned, Beaucastel has an awesome track record and it appears that, with time, the '05 is going to be really impressive.

Just my opinion, but a couple of my tasting experiences were after it was open for well over 24 hours and it was still brutally tannic; as the structure is currently suffocating the fruit. Underneath the sheath of tendon is some solid, typical Pegau character that may indeed flesh out, but its going to need a LOT of time…and the ‘05 lacks the intrinsic harmony of the ’04…and it’s much more expensive to boot!

...'brutally' tannic? sounds like a 73 point wine to me...Yes, the wine is structured and backward now, but not out of balance.

The '05 Pegau is still outstanding for me, but not nearly as dynamic as the '03/'04 duo. It's not a style of vintage that suits Laurence who prefers a rich, porty style of wine. And she also introduced a new foudre into her cellar for the '05 vintage, so the influence of that new oak component on the overall blend can't be dismissed. In retrospect (and Laurence admits this) it probably wasn't the right vintage to have a large portion of juice in new oak...

Despite the differing profile of the '05 Pegau, it is still far better than her '95 (as is the vintage in general), which has always been rather awkward. When I did my '95 retrospective a few years back, two bottles of it were hard and spritzy, and were left out of the final tally...

Hard and spritzy? Interesting...travel shock? The '95 is more austere & chunky, but still full of the telltale Pegau spice character that I adore so much. The structure seems more pronounced than the more modest core of fruit & its less polished than most recent vintages of Pegau...but to me, it's still an outstanding Pegau and seems cut from the same cloth as the '05. David Gordon still has some great bottles at Tribeca w/ dynamite provenance.

When I tasted the '95s, it was on location in CdP. Bottles were provided by the domaines (this was all mentioned in the story), so travel shock and provenance not an issue...

quote:

Originally posted by James Molesworth:
When I tasted the '95s, it was on location in CdP. Bottles were provided by the domaines (this was all mentioned in the story), so travel shock and provenance not an issue...

Hmmm- no clue, doesn't sound anything like my experiences w/ the '95s (Laurence & Reservee). It is a bit firmer & less generous than the '00, '01, '03, 04...found it most in line w/ the '05 in terms of high tannin & bright acidity...would imagine they'd age along somewhat of a similar curve.

I'm just a bit more skeptical about the '05...but in general I think the vintage struck a bit more of a chord w/ you than it did me (not saying I don't think there were some spectacular wines from it).

Would like to taste some Rhones w/ you at some point...the Bonneau vertical was unreal!

Brad: Do you mind if I ask you are in the industry? If not, how do you get involved in these tastings? Can anyone participate? We just don't have anything like them in my city. Just curious.

quote:

Originally posted by Keeno:
Brad: Do you mind if I ask you are in the industry? If not, how do you get involved in these tastings? Can anyone participate? We just don't have anything like them in my city. Just curious.

How dare you Not at all Keeno- I actually set up most of the Chateauneuf tastings...personally can barely afford one Bonneau wine, much less his big dogs from the '90s...but put together a big group of NYC geeks and that's the way I taste 'em all (the offlines from message boards are where I do a lot of damage)! The trade tastings I get into are mostly due to contacts I've made- the industry is very accessible in general and I've been lucky to be in contact w/ great people.

All of my income & time goes to wine & wine travel...yet, the jokes on me at the end of the day as I still make zero dollars for it! It's something I hope to change as soon as possible.

Well Brad, I must admit a little jealousy. You have tasted some great wines. I get together with friends locally, but we don't have access to a lot of this stuff. I am trying to sock away wines for the future, and buy more mature stuff when I possible.
Thanks for the info. Clearly I need to participate in an offline somewhere at some point. It is obviously a great way to meet folks and taste some good wines.

quote:

Originally posted by Brad Coelho:
All of my income & time goes to wine & wine travel...yet, the jokes on me at the end of the day as I still make zero dollars for it! It's something I hope to change as soon as possible.

I do applaud your passion, Brad.

<bump>

OK, that's it. Now I'm done with buying 2005.

Clos des Papes
Vieux Donjon
Coulon Beaurenard
Janasse Chaupin
Vieux Telegraphe, Le Crau White
Vieux Telegraphe, Le Crau
Saint-Prefert, Charles Guiraud
Saint-Prefert, Reserve Auguste Favier
Vacheron-Pouzin, Domaine du Caillou, Les Quartz
Domaine de Grand Veneur, Les Origines
Daumen Pere & Fils, La Vieille Julienne
Domaine de la Charbonniere, Vieilles Vignes
Domaine de la Charbonniere, Les Hautes Brusquieres
La Crau de Ma Mere
Cuvee du Vatican, Reserve Sixtine
Tardieu-Laurent, Cuvee Speciale
Tardieu-Laurent, Vieilles Vignes
Clos du Mont-Olivet
Clos Saint Jean, Deus Ex Machina
Domaine de la Cote de l'Ange
Domaine Lafond, Roc-Epine
Lucien Barrot
Patrick Lesec, Pierres Dorees
Domaine des Senechaux
Clos Saint Michel, Cuvee Reservee
Domaine de Cristia, Vieilles Vignes

quote:

Originally posted by steve8:
<bump>

OK, that's it. Now I'm done with buying 2005.

Clos des Papes
Vieux Donjon
Coulon Beaurenard
Janasse Chaupin
Vieux Telegraphe, Le Crau White
Vieux Telegraphe, Le Crau
Saint-Prefert, Charles Guiraud
Saint-Prefert, Reserve Auguste Favier
Vacheron-Pouzin, Domaine du Caillou, Les Quartz
Domaine de Grand Veneur, Les Origines
Daumen Pere & Fils, La Vieille Julienne
Domaine de la Charbonniere, Vieilles Vignes
Domaine de la Charbonniere, Les Hautes Brusquieres
La Crau de Ma Mere
Cuvee du Vatican, Reserve Sixtine
Tardieu-Laurent, Cuvee Speciale
Tardieu-Laurent, Vieilles Vignes
Clos du Mont-Olivet
Clos Saint Jean, Deus Ex Machina
Domaine de la Cote de l'Ange
Domaine Lafond, Roc-Epine
Lucien Barrot
Patrick Lesec, Pierres Dorees
Domaine des Senechaux
Clos Saint Michel, Cuvee Reservee
Domaine de Cristia, Vieilles Vignes

Very impressive. Your list is more than twice as long as mine would be...

quote:

Originally posted by steve8:
<bump>

OK, that's it. Now I'm done with buying 2005.

Clos des Papes
Vieux Donjon
Coulon Beaurenard
Janasse Chaupin
Vieux Telegraphe, Le Crau White
Vieux Telegraphe, Le Crau
Saint-Prefert, Charles Guiraud
Saint-Prefert, Reserve Auguste Favier
Vacheron-Pouzin, Domaine du Caillou, Les Quartz
Domaine de Grand Veneur, Les Origines
Daumen Pere & Fils, La Vieille Julienne
Domaine de la Charbonniere, Vieilles Vignes
Domaine de la Charbonniere, Les Hautes Brusquieres
La Crau de Ma Mere
Cuvee du Vatican, Reserve Sixtine
Tardieu-Laurent, Cuvee Speciale
Tardieu-Laurent, Vieilles Vignes
Clos du Mont-Olivet
Clos Saint Jean, Deus Ex Machina
Domaine de la Cote de l'Ange
Domaine Lafond, Roc-Epine
Lucien Barrot
Patrick Lesec, Pierres Dorees
Domaine des Senechaux
Clos Saint Michel, Cuvee Reservee
Domaine de Cristia, Vieilles Vignes

No Pegaü? How about Rayas? And André Brunel? And Usseglio?

Must be tough to "limit" yourself to the above-mentioned list

quote:

Originally posted by Impulse:

No Pegaü? How about Rayas? And André Brunel? And Usseglio?

Must be tough to "limit" yourself to the above-mentioned list

I passed on the Pegau this vintage. Rayas is too expensive for me. I didn't have the chance to buy the 05 Les Cailloux. I also passed on the Usseglio, which I'm now regretting a little after tasting the 01.

quote:

Originally posted by steve8:

quote:

Originally posted by Impulse:

No Pegaü? How about Rayas? And André Brunel? And Usseglio?

Must be tough to "limit" yourself to the above-mentioned list

I passed on the Pegau this vintage. Rayas is too expensive for me. I didn't have the chance to buy the 05 Les Cailloux. I also passed on the Usseglio, which I'm now regretting a little after tasting the 01.

The Usseglio is still at the Signature. I got a bottle on Saturday. As far as Pegau is concerned, I am the King of Pegau, not Steve8. Hence, no real need for him to buy such wines.