Every restaurateur I know can never simply go out and enjoy a restaurant without ending up critiquing it, in highly specialized, "insider" terms. I have a buddy who owns 6 restaurants, and he's always in the dog house for about a week after taking his wife to dinner because she sees it as a date and a chance for them to talk, but he immediately starts wondering about food cost, turning plates over to see the maker, commenting on plate presentations in a clinical way, and so on.

As it applies to wine, does your wine geekiness or the fact that you are "into" wine to a degree that 90% of all consumers are not, interfere with your ability to just shut up and enjoy the wine before you without giving the wine the third degree? Can you focus on your company and the moment without the mind wandering into wine criticism?

quote:

Originally posted by cdr11:
Can you focus on your company and the moment without the mind wandering into wine criticism?

Every time we're w/ company. I may make a mental TN when I try the wine, but that is it. The experience is what counts (company, location, discussion). After all, it is just fermented grape juice. I think if you put wine before everything else (like your buddy does w/ his restaurants), you have a serious problem.

By the way... nice topic, I don't think it has ever been done before.

Simply enjoy? Yes.

With really great bottles and vintages, the discussion always turns to THE WINE. Everybody I socialize with is a collector of wines, so naturally we talk about it. Do we hold nightly bit@h sessions about wines? NO. Can we have a great time talking about something else while we drink? YES. Have I ever opened a wine, and not talked about it with company? Nope. I think wine accelerates and accentuates great conversation with friends.

quote:

Originally posted by cdr11:
Can you focus on your company and the moment without the mind wandering into wine criticism?

Only if it's a decent wine. If the wine is plonk, then I'll just forget the wine and focus on what's at hand.

Personally, I can't enjoy a wine without comparing it, thinking about it, analyzing it. However, unless I'm in a group of other confirmed wine geeks I rarely share my thoughts with my dining partners.

I think the bad name that wine geeks get is largely due to their tendency to spout off about a wine in the company of those who only care to enjoy it, rather than think about it.

mike1026

quote:

Everybody I socialize with is a collector of wines, so naturally we talk about it.

Thats quite impressive. I on the other hand am the lone one in our circle who truely could be the wine geek. Most of our friends and family enjoy wine, but do not goto the lengths of furthering their wine knowledge like I do.

I can sit back and enjoy wine without talking about it, but in my head I am usually making mental TN's.

Jason

I hear ya Vino. My father in-law got me into wines in 1994, and I've pretty much educated EVERY single one of my friends since!

My rambling thoughts on this subject from my 2000th post a year ago.

Ya know...I just don't buy the whole, "Wine is just fermented grape juice" euphemism. Sure, it ain't life or death, but it certainly holds more for me than just that. There have been great wine moments in my life that I will never forget. Not just moments, BUT wine moments. I agree with all of you that wines are meant to be enjoyed above all else. Personally, I don't get wine investors. Please don't turn wine into a friggin' commodity. Wine is special. From antiquity to today, wine has held a more special place than just "fermented grape juice"...please.

When dining with my wife and son, we just enjoy the wine since there is no reason to discuss it ad nausium. However, most of my friends know I'm a wine geek so when I'm with them, I usually ask what they think of the wine and why then move on to other topics. When with the DC Cru, the discussion always revolves around the wine, but then we have enough sense to go on to other things.

mike1026: I couldn't agree more. To use the euphemism is to trivialize the interest we all have and come here for. (I hope I don't have to include the caveat that this is my opinion... oops, too late.)

Like VinoMiko the people I drink wine with are not really into dissecting the nuances of the wine in hand. They just want to enjoy the wine and the company. Someone may ask me what I think of the wine and I'll tell them; ONLY THEN do I ask them for their input. Since they are not wine geeks I wait for them to make the first move in this area.

I, too, make a quick mental note about the taste and move on.

Wine is to be enjoyed and most of the time I find that analyzing it too far can take away from the overall experience of the company, surroundings, and events.

David,

I agree with you 100%.

I guess I was too harsh in my "fermended grape juice" comment. I was trying to make the point that the most important thing (in my mind) would be the company (be it friends or family). I've been to several places where I observed someone saying... "This came from so-and-so's vineyard" or "I can really taste the valley fruit"... all the while the other person (or persons) seems disgusted with the situation.

If others want to talk about it, I'm all the happier. But if it isn't a thought in their mind, then it isn't in mine either. Life is too short, and before you know it, friends and family and no longer with us. I'd rather have a memory of them then the wine I was drinking.

I'm mainly the one my company would expect some contemplation about the wine from. If I can I will give away some information or a quote about it.
If I say that ripe riesling tends to smell like gazoline, that's something they can understand and remember.
Years later they will still attack me with: "had a riesling yesterday, you know: diesel, uh."

That's it mainly, the rest of the time is entirely for the company.
Except of course for the fact that if the wine is shaait, it's shaait, no matter wetter someone's volunteering to swallow it anyway.

The people I hang with typically aren't interested in dissecting a wine, so I have learned by necessity to enjoy in silence.

The only time I get anti-social about it is at a restaurant with a great wine list. I can tune out a little bit going through a good list.

Good topic CDR. I probably bring my own wine 85% of the time and the other 15% we know the list, so even with we are with non winos, at least I'm happy -with the wine. If it's off, I'll say something in fun.

Food and Service, forget it. I am a vicious critic with those. So much so, that my wife prefers we stick with places she knows I like. If I had to worry about the wine too, I'd be impossible to dine with!

I don't think I have the depth of knowledge of most of you guys to get real detailed or technical with my TN's, BUT one of the things I like best about great wine is serving it to people that I care about. So once I explain to them what they are drinking, I discuss it only as much as they wish to know. The rest is just to enjoy the company, enhanced by the drink.

I like geeking it out when I'm at dinner with fellow wine geeks, although I try not to let that take up too much of the conversation.

When on a "date" with future Mrs. Whiner, I like to comment on the wine for a few seconds, and then not again. Of course, it I'm drinking a "wow" wine I cannot help but talk about it.

a

quote:

one of the things I like best about great wine is serving it to people that I care about.

Deryl,

Some of my favorite wine moments have occurred just looking in the face of someone who I've provided with a "wine epiphany." Frikkin' wonderful to see them light up!!

PH

Here's one that gets my goat every time because it's happened more than once. You get invited to dinner with people that are known to be wine geeks or at least wine lovers. You bring them a nice wine that you believe they will really enjoy. You get there and they pull out Grandma's half-inch thick, frosted, etched and cut, straight-sided glasses to drink this wine in. You get this solid lump in your throat as they cork your prize wine and pour it into these abominations. They try the wine and say, "gosh, this is really a great wine". You try it and say to yourself, "tastes like plonk, what a way to ruin a great wine".

At this point I have trouble enjoying the rest of the evening.

Good company helps improve a good wine experience, and sometimes good wine helps make good company!!!


DBW

I was going to jump in on this until I saw the tlily post. I really have nothing more to add...

Ditto to the tlily 2000th post!

Lou - For me, it only takes one of those episodes to place those friends on the under $20 mass produced wine list from now on.

Louz, next time bring "those" friends a six of Sam Adams instead.

It happened three different times with three different couples, and I don't think I've brought anymore wine to any of the three again. The Samuel Adams is a good idea if there is a next time.