You all do realize that he wasn't named honorary citizen of CdP without reason right?

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Originally posted by riku:
You all do realize that he wasn't named honorary citizen of CdP without reason right?

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Originally posted by FL Wino Spouse:
Jfont What was the price range of these Rhones?

I don't know man...sorry.

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Originally posted by Brashley:

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Originally posted by Red guy in a blue state:
Eyeballing a lot of unsold 05 CdPs at one of my LWSs. I wonder if they are going to blow some of these out at bargain basement prices. Hardly any movement on any of these wines for quite a while. I am sure they want to make room for wines from the vintage of a lifetime.

make the owner an offer. in early jan. of this year, I noticed one of my lws still had 8 bottles of the '05 Boislauzon 'quet' sitting in his store ... i knew they'd been there awhile ... he was (not) moving 'em at $60 or $65 ... I told him i'd take 'em all if he gave 'em to me for $50. Sold. I walked out with a huuuge smile on my face. The worst that could've happened is being told "no." Even if you get a "no," you've planted the seed in the owner's head that those wines will move at lower prices. go make an offer.

I was thinking the same thing. I have a decent relationship with this establishment. I agree: the worst he could do is say no.

There are a bunch of retailers that have '05 and '06 but I hardly feel comfortable negotiating a discount since there is only one of me with no relationship with a specific retailer since there are so many of them here in the NYC area

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Originally posted by James Molesworth:

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Originally posted by Keeno:
I don' know what to make of it. There are so many superlatives in his report/scores. I feel like I need to balance that with Molesworth (whom I trust a lot) and Raynolds. I bought a lot of '07s. I am sure that I will like the wines, but not to the level of Parker. It will be interesting to see what happens.
A part of me can't help but feel that a lot of my favorite producers just won WOTY and that the price increases are coming. Sort of sucks, but what are you going to do?

Alas, the producers will not see any part of the price increases that come after the wines leave their domaines (most '07s now well into the pipeline here). The speculation now all goes to benefit the distributors, importers and retailers.

The producers will also have a hard time trading in on the success of '07 with the '08s, as it is a difficult vintage...

Thanks for posting James. I was referring to retailers. After the scores were posted, I noticed that some had already raised prices significantly on top scoring wines. A bummer, but there is plenty of good wine from other vintages to be had.

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Originally posted by Keeno:

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Originally posted by James Molesworth:

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Originally posted by Keeno:
I don' know what to make of it. There are so many superlatives in his report/scores. I feel like I need to balance that with Molesworth (whom I trust a lot) and Raynolds. I bought a lot of '07s. I am sure that I will like the wines, but not to the level of Parker. It will be interesting to see what happens.
A part of me can't help but feel that a lot of my favorite producers just won WOTY and that the price increases are coming. Sort of sucks, but what are you going to do?

Alas, the producers will not see any part of the price increases that come after the wines leave their domaines (most '07s now well into the pipeline here). The speculation now all goes to benefit the distributors, importers and retailers.

The producers will also have a hard time trading in on the success of '07 with the '08s, as it is a difficult vintage...

Thanks for posting James. I was referring to retailers. After the scores were posted, I noticed that some had already raised prices significantly on top scoring wines. A bummer, but there is plenty of good wine from other vintages to be had.

First it was 08 bordeaux, now 07 CdP, maybe parker losing it, maybe parker retiring and this is going away present, maybe parker right, maybe none of the above, who knows

Big points sell (and not just the wines, but also Parker subscriptions).

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Originally posted by tannic bastard:

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Originally posted by Keeno:

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Originally posted by Stefania Wine:
Parker, Miller, Pant Load jumped the Shark for me some time ago

I am unfamiliar with this expression. What does it mean?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=jumped+the+Shark

Thanks. Since I felt like a moron, I even asked around the office yesterday and no one had heard of it. I asked my wife and she hadn't heard of it either. Is it more of a regional expression?

Sorry to say it's a pretty widely known/used expression, first popularized about 10 years ago.

Keeno - Maybe it's a generational thing

Haha. Maybe you're right snipes.

Sorry about the drift, but I appreciate the info. Back to talking Chateauneuf.

I looked at a major wine site yesterday when this was posted. Looked again this morning.

This site, who will remain nameless, raised prices on these about 15%. As we said, scores sell.

At least Miller did not score these.

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At least Miller did not score these.

Without the initials at the end of the reviews, it would be impossible to tell...

Moo

Can't believe the review on the Ferrand. Price has jumped from $45 to $75.

Philippe Bravay is a young Turk, whose wines I've been touting for a few years now (reviews/notes here)...vintages pre-'03 were not destemmed; since then the wines have been sleeker and lusher. The wines are very primal when young and their track record of development is still in progress.

If you want some background on Bravay, my last blog entry is here; my '07 visit is detailed here and my initial profile on him is here.

Maybe I need to drop a triple digit on the guy?

I have a hard enough time really enjoying Grenache's high alcohol and high toned agressive personality. I like CDP...sometimes a lot, but I definitely do not "love" it.

I truly have no interest in a vintage that takes 15% high toned fruit, and amplifies it to 16-17%. If extreme ripeness, monster alcohol, and mega tannin is what exemplifies a "great vintage", then I prefer the recent "good" ones like 2004, 2005, 2006, that show some restraint, and exemplify a more "classic" personality. One that, for me, is also more enjoyable with a meal.

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Originally posted by Sacred Cow:

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At least Miller did not score these.

Without the initials at the end of the reviews, it would be impossible to tell...

Moo

If we had the WA Issue, normally they will list who wrote the article. Trust that the author is also the taster. Maybe they have blind tasters reather than tasting blind.

Dr.: The key to '07 is Mourvèdre - the harvest ran so late that Mourvèdre really ripened beautifully with rounded tannins, a rarity for this tannic grape. It's the spine to the flesh of the Grenache.

I don't find a lot of high-toned fruit in '07 because of this late harvest. The cuvées with %10+ of Mourvèdre are the stars - dark w/ loam, mesquite and roasted earth notes. But the mouthfeel of '07 is very polished, especially when compared to racy vintages like '01 and classic grippy vintages like '05.

So - dark in profile, but accessible in feel. It's easy to see why some are falling hard for the vintage, stylistically. It's just that for me, style and quality are always two separate issues.

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I truly have no interest in a vintage that takes 15% high toned fruit, and amplifies it to 16-17%. If extreme ripeness, monster alcohol, and mega tannin is what exemplifies a "great vintage", then I prefer the recent "good" ones like 2004, 2005, 2006, that show some restraint, and exemplify a more "classic" personality. One that, for me, is also more enjoyable with a meal.

Agree. Noticed over the last 10 years alcohol levels have moved from about 10% up to 16%. These alcohol bombs are not for my palette. Would be a lot happier with a level of 12%. Less acidic. These higher levels distress my stomach as I have GERD.

I blame RMP for moving wines to the higher levels.

Have not studied the ‘classic’ personality, but from what I have tasted the alcohol level is less.

When I see these higher levels, I tend not to purchase them.

FL Wino Spouse: You saw '99 CdPs at alcohol levels of %10...?

'90s were at %14 easy...

CdP has always been a high-alcohol wine, if by that you feel %14+ is high for red table wine. But Grenache's unique ability is to still have balance and finesse at high alcohols. The key is low yields - much like Pinot Noir, Grenache goes wonky much above 35 hl/ha.

The difference in CdP today is a lower percentage of stems being used; cleaner fermentations (i.e temp controlled steel or clean cement vats) and later harvesting which results in smoother, more supple tannins. This has resulted in wines which don't show their higher alcohol levels. Better balance, better wines...

Can this sometimes be exacerbated to the extreme however? Sure - some wines can be over extracted or top heavy...

But let's not forget this is a warm climate viticultural area that has experienced several successive drought-influenced vintages, but by the grace of generations of experience, relies on grapes suited to that environment that are further enhanced by being 40, 50, 60 years old and up in terms of vines age.

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Originally posted by James Molesworth:
Philippe Bravay is a young Turk, whose wines I've been touting for a few years now (reviews/notes here)...vintages pre-'03 were not destemmed; since then the wines have been sleeker and lusher. The wines are very primal when young and their track record of development is still in progress.

If you want some background on Bravay, my last blog entry is here; my '07 visit is detailed here and my initial profile on him is here.

Maybe I need to drop a triple digit on the guy?

Ha! Thanks again. I actually studied your TNs and cellar notes prior to purchasing the '07. He has been a producer that I have been meaning to try based on your previous reviews. I was fortunate to grab some '04s and will probably grab some '05s.

Since you are checking these threads, I have a couple of questions: Will these '07s develop garrigue notes, game, leather, etc. with age or do the wines have to express them in their youth? Since a lot folks are worried that this vintage is overripe, can you compare it to another lush, fruit-forward vintage on release and tell us how you expect them to develop based on that?

Keeno: Hard to compare '07 to another vintage - it is unique. Maybe '89 in terms of ripeness? But they are far more uniform and accessible right out of the gate.

The '07s will develop the garrigue/tobacco notes down the road - but I don't think they'll be as pronounced as in vintages like '05, '01, '98. The '07s will always be marked by their precocious fruit and I think ultimately they'll age on a slightly faster track because of it, as '00 has done vis a vis '98 for example.

James that's interesting about the mourvedre. I was tasting some wines the other day with a few producers and really liked the blends with more mourvedre. Didn't really think too much about it at the time but I can see the point. One fellow had a fantastic carignan too but it would be something like $50 on the shelf and nobody ever heard of him so I don't see that showing up.

Anyhow, I was also fortunate enough to have tasted many of these 2007s several times, the last time this past week before I knew that some of them were going to be given 100 points. To each his own I imagine, and the wines were surely nice enough but for the life of me I couldn't see 100 points for some of them. By and large I found them sweet, ripe, clean, almost jammy, but lacking something that would make them seem, well, perfect? I have some 98s and 2001s and from memory, those had more spine when young.

Florida -

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I blame RMP for moving wines to the higher levels.

No way. I have to disagree.

He likes what he likes and more than almost anyone else, he's caused that area to get the attention from "serious" wine people that it's getting today. But he doesn't make wine. And he doesn't pass legislation to mandate higher alcohol levels or any of the other things he's blamed for.

If you want to look where the blame lies, just take a look at all the people on this board and other boards who are rushing out to get those wines because of the scores. Those are the people to "blame". The producer doesn't want to sit on his "art". He's making a product and needs to move it. If people buy riper, he makes riper. And if people follow Parker like sheep, that's their fault, not Parkers.

Same w the WOTY for WS. Nobody forces anyone to buy highly rated wines.

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No way. I have to disagree.

He likes what he likes and more than almost anyone else, he's caused that area to get the attention from "serious" wine people that it's getting today. But he doesn't make wine. And he doesn't pass legislation to mandate higher alcohol levels or any of the other things he's blamed for.

If you want to look where the blame lies, just take a look at all the people on this board and other boards who are rushing out to get those wines because of the scores. Those are the people to "blame". The producer doesn't want to sit on his "art". He's making a product and needs to move it. If people buy riper, he makes riper. And if people follow Parker like sheep, that's their fault, not Parkers.

Same w the WOTY for WS. Nobody forces anyone to buy highly rated wines.

It's easy to fall back on this argument. Of course, one could argue that the person who yells "Fire" in a crowded theatre isn't at fault, but rather it's those who panic and trample others in their scramble to exit the theatre. In reality, both are responsible, and I think it's the same with Parker.

IMO, Parker must certainly know what impact his ratings have (using the fiction that he's just being honest to some sort of system), he knows that the entire concept of a 100 point wine is ridiculous, and yet he uses it anyway in what I perceive is an attempt to exert further commercial benefit for his business. Many of his subscribers have urged him to reconsider aspects of how he rates wine, but yet the only budging seems to be in the direction of increasing the rate of 100 point wines over time.