As a parent, I agree we should be the ones to educate our children on the responsible use of alcohol, which is indeed a powerful drug. And I feel we should do it before they get to 21. Too many kinds want to turn 21 so they can "do drugs". While they don't style it that way, they are talking about getting knock-down drunk at keggers, and so on. A great wine with a great dinner is a way to introduce the differences between approaching wine as a food item as opposed to a drug.

And as a parent, I believe we should teach our children the responsible use of language. What is there in the lyrics of Tool's album "Opiate" that is responsible? Link here, read, and cringe. Let me ask you, if I were to make wine with half the contents of each bottle filled with raw sewage, feces and urine and try to sell it, would anyone buy it? I don't appreciate "artists" that want to sell their music with half the lyrics filled with raw sewage, feces and urine, and yet they sell it and some buy it. There's a vast difference between responsible drinking and responsible music. And Tool's music is totally irresponsible. I love classical music. Unquestionably, Wagner was a great composer, yet also rabidly anti-semitic. Should I then use Hitler's love of Wagner's music as a way to encourage chidlren or adults to appreciate classical music? Should I use Tool's lead singer's love of classic wines to encourage children or adults to appreciate classic wines? No and no.

Umm,

might wanna stay away from (now defunct)Alice in Chains as well.

From "Junkhead"..

"What's my drug of choice?,
Well what have you got?,
I don't go broke,
And I do it a lot."

It(Dirt)is an album full of depression,misery,and rejection - not wholly unlike the poetry of A.E. Housman which I also enjoy.

tool is really kinda tame by today's standards - but thank goodness for those "Warning-Explicit Lyrics" advisories!

Drink one for me Maynard!

peace/owt.

funny wine quip goes here.

Back to the topic-

I don't really find articles like this of any worth. Whether someone is rich enough to buy a cellar of fabulous wines or not is not of prurient interest to me. Indeed it borders on vulgar and boorish. But so does the magazine.

Rather, I would find the stories behind those transitioning careers into the wine business of more interest... detailing what they learned, and how they adapted and grew and dealt with the process from grape planting to harvest and the people from investors to winemakers.

Well looky here now every time I see me a truck thats all jacked up and what not with big tires they got a tool sticker on the window. I think to myself yup yup that guy drivin that truck is a tool.

I got no remorse for the things I've done, watch out honey were gonna have some FUN!

No argument there. You have some pretty interesting lyrics yourself Frank

Well thanky thanky steve!!

I got no remorse for the things I've done, watch out honey were gonna have some FUN!

quote:

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Originally posted by DHGOYINS:
As a parent, I agree we should be the ones to educate our children on the responsible use of alcohol, which is indeed a powerful drug. And I feel we should do it before they get to 21. Too many kinds want to turn 21 so they can "do drugs". While they don't style it that way, they are talking about getting knock-down drunk at keggers, and so on. A great wine with a great dinner is a way to introduce the differences between approaching wine as a food item as opposed to a drug.

And as a parent, I believe we should teach our children the responsible use of language. http://www.toolband.com/album/lyrics/opiate.html Let me ask you, if I were to make wine with half the contents of each bottle filled with raw sewage, feces and urine and try to sell it, would anyone buy it? I don't appreciate "artists" that want to sell their music with half the lyrics filled with raw sewage, feces and urine, and yet they sell it and some buy it. There's a vast difference between responsible drinking and responsible music. And Tool's music is totally irresponsible. I love classical music. Unquestionably, Wagner was a great composer, yet also rabidly anti-semitic. Should I then use Hitler's love of Wagner's music as a way to encourage chidlren or adults to appreciate classical music? Should I use Tool's lead singer's love of classic wines to encourage children or adults to appreciate classic wines? No and no.

---

Raw sewage, feces and urine? I've been an extreme fan of Tool for 12 years. The lyrics and music of each Tool album is a steady progression. The 12 year old "Opiate" lyrics are nothing compared to the more mature Tool of today. Look at the lyrics of 2001's "Lateralus" record. The singer talks about letting grudges go, waiting out tedious projects for better things to come, and how he is only as bright as the people who surround him. Sometimes recognizing the negative helps to project the positive. Feces and urine, ignorant. Education and understanding, intelligent.
paranoidvampire....

quote:

---

Originally posted by DHGOYINS:
As a parent, I agree we should be the ones to educate our children on the responsible use of alcohol, which is indeed a powerful drug. And I feel we should do it before they get to 21. Too many kinds want to turn 21 so they can "do drugs". While they don't style it that way, they are talking about getting knock-down drunk at keggers, and so on. A great wine with a great dinner is a way to introduce the differences between approaching wine as a food item as opposed to a drug.

And as a parent, I believe we should teach our children the responsible use of language. http://www.toolband.com/album/lyrics/opiate.html Let me ask you, if I were to make wine with half the contents of each bottle filled with raw sewage, feces and urine and try to sell it, would anyone buy it? I don't appreciate "artists" that want to sell their music with half the lyrics filled with raw sewage, feces and urine, and yet they sell it and some buy it. There's a vast difference between responsible drinking and responsible music. And Tool's music is totally irresponsible. I love classical music. Unquestionably, Wagner was a great composer, yet also rabidly anti-semitic. Should I then use Hitler's love of Wagner's music as a way to encourage chidlren or adults to appreciate classical music? Should I use Tool's lead singer's love of classic wines to encourage children or adults to appreciate classic wines? No and no.

---

you sound old and you sound as if you fear anything you do not understand, which seems to be alot.

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www.mojorib.com

i agree with steve8 - Wilco ROCKS! Now that's a band. Throw in some Son Volt and Uncle Tupelo and you got the makins for an evening of kickin tunes.

When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. TBird, you can reach me at 310-495-5412.

Personally I see nothing wrong with Maynards lyrics. And I've been listening to Tool since `93 at the age of 13. Hasn't warped my mind. (ok, well maybe just a bit)

==================
AIM: Drunken Mariachi

Ah, what a fine time to state the obvious.

The beauty of tool, (the old) Rage Against the Machine, Alice in Chains, and so on and so forth is that they are not subjected to anyone randomly. Of course they do have those "Explicit Lyrics" stickers which strangely enough draw kids to them like a magnet.

They are not played on Top 40 radio, they don't pop up on the toob between re-runs of "Friends" and "Seinfeld", and they are rarely aired in Dentist's offices or elevators.

One purchases the work of these artists for his own enjoyment or, perhaps, one may enlist a search engine to learn more about them on the WWW.

Either way YOU take the initiative and YOU accept responsibility.

Know that when you seek knowledge, that knowledge comes to you without condition.


funny wine quip goes here.

DJ, Wino, to disagree in an agreeable manner, as you have, with my personal opinion on Tool is a matter that needn't be debated further. And while I do not entirely agree with either of you, I've respectfully listened to your point of view. That said, it is an unfortunate thing that there are too many people in this world who when they want to disagree do so in a manner that proves only that they would make excellent illustrations in a proctology textbook.

quote:

---

Originally posted by DHGOYINS:
DJ, Wino, to disagree in an agreeable manner, as you have, with my personal opinion on Tool is a matter that needn't be debated further. And while I do not entirely agree with either of you, I've respectfully listened to your point of view. That said, it is an unfortunate thing that there are too many people in this world who when they want to disagree do so in a manner that proves only that they would make excellent illustrations in a proctology textbook.

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look in the mirror buddy.

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www.mojorib.com

quote:

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Originally posted by DHGOYINS:
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. TBird, you can reach me at 310-495-5412.

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i didn't see any "debate". only you spewing your opinions as facts.

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www.mojorib.com

Okay kids. It's time for bed. Turn off MTV now. Good night. The grown ups are going to stay up and discuss wine.

Hey Mattach, seeing as you're from Seattle, you may as well throw The Minus 5 in there as well.

I'll hijack this thread yet

steve, it's all yours my friend!
rs, you could try ignoring threads that begin with "tool's lead singer"...

cheers all. even you. dhg.



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www.mojorib.com

TBird, why should I continue making a fool of you when you are doing such a fine job of it yourself? But, the next time, if instead of picking a fight for no reason and one you don't have the ability to win, you might instead learn to bite your tongue in which event you'll die from acid poisoning.

TBird, why should I make a fool of you when you are doing such a fine job of it yourself? But, the next time, if instead of picking a fight for no reason and one you don't have the ability to win, you might instead learn to bite your tongue in which event you'll die from acid poisoning.

DHGOYINS. Bad time for a double post.

DHGOYINS

With all due respect, I think that it's you who's attempting to be provocative and rude (although it is your thread, I suppose.

The ironic thing is that you yourself used disgusting imagery to complain about what you consider disgusting lyrics. You really started fanning the flames by talking about Hitler as well. So, what's your beef with tbird? and what's your beef with Tool? Apparently, you don't think it's wrong to talk about disgusting things, right?

I can understand why the lyrics of the song you linked to might offend your political and religious sensibilities. After all, it's just Marxist-Leninist doctrine reworded. And yet, the best art provokes, prods, can be uncomfortable but above all, generates discussion and challenges people to think. I think tool has done all of that, not only here but in the marketplace.

So, I guess that we can say that Tool isn't your cup of tea. Fair enough. It just seems like you're emulating Tool more than distancing yourself from them.

[This message was edited by dwIII on Feb 12, 2004 at 10:21 AM.]

quote:

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Originally posted by DHGOYINS:
TBird, why should I make a fool of you when you are doing such a fine job of it yourself? But, the next time, if instead of picking a fight for no reason and one you don't have the ability to win, you might instead learn to bite your tongue in which event you'll die from acid poisoning.

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Suggestion. Click back to your Tool lyrics icon. Read the lyrics for the song "Jerk Off" on the Opiate album and wonder why they would write such a song.