I've enjoyed the excellent P/V wines listed below over the past few years:

'97 Sebastiani SC Cab 90 pts
'99 Ch. St. Michelle CV Cab 90 pts
'00 Concha y Toro Marques de Casa 90 pts
'00 Peter Lehman Barrosa Cab 90 pts
'99 Simi AV Cab 90 pts
'99 Columbia Crest G Estates 89 pts?

All the cabs that remain in my rather full Eurocave are keepers/special occasion wines. Do you really have to spend $25 or $30 to get a decent cab today? Please advise!

p.s. I'd rather drink a good cold beer ($1/bottle) than an average wine ($15 to $25/bottle anyday.

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Originally posted by DFish:
Do you really have to spend $25 or $30 to get a decent cab today? Please advise!

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Look at what you have. None of those are over $15 per bottle, and all are great. So, no... you don't have to.

I must say... your list is great. We must have the same tastes because I have all the same wines, and have loved each one. The following have great wines (if your tastes are like mine) just about every vintage: Concha y Toro Marques de Casa, Columbia Crest Grand Estates. Also, there is some great cheap stuff from Chile and Australia. Stay away from CA, and you should find some great buys.

Thanks for the encouraging words, but I'm out of these cabs -- I have none left in the $10-$15 price range. My question is, what can one replace them with in a similar P/V ratio today? Your point on California is quite true and well documented in the mag and these forums. Bummer.

I don't really understand your question, you could just replace them with the same wines. The ones I'm familiar with are always available.

If you're looking for different wines, however, try these blends.

Hedges CMS or Three Vineyards, you may have to shop around but you can get Three Vineyards for ~$15.

Waterbrook Melange ~$10

Anything from Barnard Griffin will be good, their main line wines are ~$10.

Also, Powers Cab ~$10

I suggest you steer yourself towards a different grape... how about syrah or pinot?

How about a Zin?

Of course, when it comes to QPR, i t is really difficult to beat the wines coming out of Australia right now.

You should sign up for Carolina Wine Company's e-mail alerts. Even if you don't order from them, they tip you off to what can be had in the market. Their latest (right up your alley) can be found here.

"The world needs ditch-diggers, too, Danny!"

The currently available vintages for these wines are less "great" than the vintages that I listed -- in my opinion. Some by a lot, some by a little.

Hey Golf and Zin Nut: Love the ditch digger reference. I recorded Caddyshack off the TV to get a "G/PG" rated version for my kids. They love it. Another question: if we can get 5 different languages on a DVD, why can't we get a kid-friendly soundtrack or edited alternative version? I do own the R rated version (just in case the FBI is monitoring for piracy offenders).

DFish, the 2002 Morambro Creek Padthway Cabernet is great, and it's only $15. Real extracted, juicy fruit.

"...and cloaked with wine I'll tell you that you're great."

You could try the following:

2000 Hess Select, runs for about $11.00 or so
2000 Blackstone though it's not in line with your tastes exactly since it's really more of a wine for "non wine drinkers" but it's still good.

Or, as suggested, you could switch grapes!

Good choices btw

Sascha

http://www.lunaravencreations.com - fine hand crafted beaded jewelry

Cheateau st michelle is great every vintage for $13 a bottle. Echelon makes a good $10 cab. Lois martini california cab, $10 bucks. Villa Mt Eden about $8 bucks for a coastal wine. If you don't want to spend alot, BV makes a coastal wine, as does mondavi. Veramonte is a good chilean wine for a $8 cabernet. Jacob's creek is a good cab for $8. Sounds like you already drink good wine in the $20 range. LIfe is too short to drink bad wine.

Search for a recent, long thread on inexpensive Cabs. Lots of ideas there. My recent favorite (often mentioned on this forum): 01 McManis, which I picked up for $8.49 per bottle.

2002 Paringa Cab (Australian) $10 - a high 80's bottle - is the first that springs to mind. I haven't tried any, but I've noticed there is a lot of of Languedoc cab/merlot/syrah blends lately on the shelves at about $10-$15

Welcome to Massachusetts - Be Fabulous and Say "I Do"

I had a 1999 Smith & Hess Cab with dinner Sat. night. Sticker was $15.99 but I paid about $14 with a discount. Bought it on the recommendation of the sales guy and was pleased with it.


I recently had the 2001 Lindeman's Reserve Cab. WS gave it either an 88 or 89 & a best value mention. The 2 bottles I bought on Saturday were $7.99 each. Can't beat that!

Rob your "piggy bank" and try the 2001 Marquis Philips "Sara's Blend".

$19.00

SIP SIP HOOREY

I see you have the 1999 Simi on your list.
Have you tried the 2001? We can get it in
the L.A. area for just under $15.00, and I
think it's better than the 1999...

Cheers!

Ps: I like a cold beer too!

Again, stay away from CA for QPR. Try CSM, Hedges or Sagelands from Washington. Angus the Bull or Marquis Philips from Australia (both $15). South America has the Montes Alpha Cab (enjoying 99,00 & 01 and a little over $15) and there's Concha y Toro Cabs which are cheap but good for the most part.

You could go different varietals but if you find something you love and want to stick with it then do it!

DFish

you can find some CA bargains in that price range. based on what you listed as previous wines enjoyed and $$$ range, this is what i'd do, with a WA ringer.

99' Sebastiani $15- (WS88-89 i think)
01' Franciscan $18- (WS89 i believe)
99'/00' CSM Cab Columbia Valley/C. Ridge $10/$17
01 Abundance Rich Red $10-
01' Justin $20- (WS89, but a lil more $$$)
01' Simi $20- (a little more then $15 but WS92-94)
01' Hess Select $13-
00' St Francis - $18 (WA90)

CC Grand Estates is $7-8 at Costco. Probably the cheapest good Cab. The 2000 is just as good as the 1999.

Otherwise, as everyone else said. Just buy the newer vintages of everything on your original list. They are all a consistent value with minimal quality changes year to year.

Pinot Noir is a great break from Cabs and drinks better earlier. Try the Sebastini Sonoma coast for $12. The 02' has enough tannins to please your cab cravings.

Wow, can't believe I haven't seen mentioned yet the best QPR since the 1990 Souverain Cab...

2001 Castle Rock Napa cab, $7.99 at LA Wine Co, and Woodland Hills Wine Co. Made from some seriously concentrated and balanced $30 cab excess juice.

Best $8.00 cab I've ever had, period, nothing has ever come close. I give it a solid 88 score. By comparison, I give the Liberty School 2001 Cab an 85, the Simi 2001 Alexander Valley an 88, and the Justin 2001 Cab an 89, and the 2001 Hess Select cab an 84. I haven't decided on the Sebastiani 2001 Alexander Valley, because I find it presents a distorted flavor profile of oak and sweet cherries, but would rate it at 89 if you like that Australian over-extracted type of style.

Enjoyed the 01 Merryvale Starmont Cab tonight. This is their base Cab and is less than $20. I loved the wine. Ready to enjoy now. Deep dark purple, nice nose and lots of up front fruit. Has some tannic structure to improve over next couple years. Mid palate was delightful with nice smooth finish. What do I know, but I'd give it 88-90 pts.

If this is any indication of what to expect from the core of the 01 Napa vintage, look out!

GKM

I just gulped an '01 David Coffaro Aca Modot which is his Bordeaux-style blend. This is easily my QPR of the year Cab. When I bought it on futures I paid about $15 but consistently tasty wine. He could charge more if he wanted and I would gladly pay.

www.coffaro.com

quote:

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Do you really have to spend $25 or $30 to get a decent cab today?

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No. But it seems like you have to spend over $35 to have better than a 50% shot at drinking a good cab. Personally, my favorite Cab under $25 is the basic Catena which sells for about $20-$22. Edge Cab (CA) is also very nice and you can buy it direct from the winery for $20. Bonus -- it has cool, purple synthetic corks and bottle looks awesome.

To be honest, excepting the above two wines, most of the Cabs I drink are on the more expensive side. Outside of just a few possible exceptions, it really doesn't seem like anyone is producing a $12-$25 Cab that can compete with the best similarly priced Toros, Gigondas, Barberas, Nebbiolos, Ripassas, Zins, etc.

Just my $0.02

a

"What contemptible scoundrel stole the cork from my lunch?" -- W.C. Fields

Whiner15,

I hear you on the other varietals/regions (Toros!) but what and where in the heckfire do you find good nebbiolo under $25?

vinohound,

They do exist! Not much under $25, but wineries such as Mauro Molino and Icardi produce great Nebbiolos in the $20 price range ($16 and $23). Villadora Barolo, though I haven't had it in a while, I recall as being another great bargain for about $23. I believe Vietti makes a Nebbiolo in this price range that is supposed to be good, but I've not had it. There are a few others that the store I frequent direct-imports, but they are not available in the general marketplace. As I've mentioned in other posts, I think, 1998 Icardi Nebbiolo probably holds the record for wine most consumed by me. I think I wound up consuming something like 16 bottles of it. Yum.

FYI: While the '01 isn't really up to snuff, Sandrone makes an excellent Nebbiolo for a little more money ($30-$35)

FYI2: I love Toros as well. Degesa Gago (dunno what vintage) for $11 is one of my all time favorite QPRs. While expensive for everyday drinking ($25) 1999 Finca Sobreno Seleccion Especial is sublime and, despite its price getting up there, is also one of my favorite QPRs of all time.

a

"What contemptible scoundrel stole the cork from my lunch?" -- W.C. Fields