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quote:
Originally posted by Stefania Wine:
Has no one said Silver Oak?

Is there a wine more loved by the masses and more hated by wine geeks and professionals? I saw three "Life is a Cabernet" license plates yesterday alone.

Rombauer Chardonnay would be second.


I did mention silver oak a couple of pages ago. I am a bit on the fence and would reserve judgment until I am able to taste an aged silver oak. Clearly the young ones are peculiar and heavily influenced by the 100% american oak.


"The hardest thing to attain ... is the appreciation of difference without insisting on superiority" George Saintsbury
 
Posts: 1687 | Location: DC Suburbs, Potomac MD. | Registered: Dec 12, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Merengue:
quote:
Originally posted by Stefania Wine:
Has no one said Silver Oak?

Is there a wine more loved by the masses and more hated by wine geeks and professionals? I saw three "Life is a Cabernet" license plates yesterday alone.

Rombauer Chardonnay would be second.


I did mention silver oak a couple of pages ago. I am a bit on the fence and would reserve judgment until I am able to taste an aged silver oak. Clearly the young ones are peculiar and heavily influenced by the 100% american oak.


we did a 1984 tasting blind.

the silveroak was the best of the bunch out of

caymus ss,
opus one
heitz martha
bv gdl
and basically the rest of the "heavy hitters" from napa.


This is my sig -> www.brownteacup.com
www.wsqwine.com
(Wine distributor)
 
Posts: 12483 | Location: NYC | Registered: Feb 16, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Primordialsoup:
2008 Schild
the wines of Brunellogate


+1 on Schild...what egg of their face
 
Posts: 789 | Location: NYC | Registered: Feb 25, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Audrey Shannon:
How about just a Red Blend in General? I personally love a good red blend. The controversy... So many people want 100% the varietal, and have this pre-conceived notion that it's not worth drinking if not.. Well as most of us know. For years wines have been blended! And they are hot sellers right now.


Confused
 
Posts: 30383 | Location: Dallas, TX & Santa Fe, NM | Registered: Feb 21, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by wine+art:
quote:
Originally posted by Audrey Shannon:
How about just a Red Blend in General? I personally love a good red blend. The controversy... So many people want 100% the varietal, and have this pre-conceived notion that it's not worth drinking if not.. Well as most of us know. For years wines have been blended! And they are hot sellers right now.


Confused


+1

wth Confused
 
Posts: 5106 | Location: Miami | Registered: Mar 30, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by GregT:
quote:
Kind of shocking to see people dismissing an entire country's wines.


It's true that they can do a fine job in SA with some varieties - at one point they were even renowned for their sweet wine. Most assuredly a wine needn't be a wow wine to be drinkable. In many cases what you're seeing in the posts is the reaction to the wines that have been made widely available outside of South Africa rather than the reaction to a few wines that aren't yet known. But many of the producers there will acknowledge that for years, their wines weren't top-shelf stuff.

I feel the same way when it comes to Chile - I'm certain that they can make good reds, but those that show up in the US tend not to be all that great. And having tasted them fairly widely over the years, I'm including both the cheap stuff and their highest end stuff. That's not to say they do absolutely nothing well ever, it's just that most of the time I'd rather drink their whites. I'd rather get my reds from elsewhere. Ditto Germany.

Besides, dogmatism is fun!

quote:
Yes, most Pinotage is plonk, but it's not made to be a Wow Wine. Still, South Africa does a fine job with several different varietals. I blind tasted the Hamilton Russell Chard a few months ago, and I was blown away...tasted more French than anything else. I immediately ordered a case for the cellar.


But then why not buy French wine? This seems like you're damning SA with faint praise indeed! The wine is so good it doesn't taste South African.

Yikes!


I do buy French wine! But, to say a region can do a fine "Burgundian" style Chard in SA is not a demerit because Chard is the chicken of the wine world and mostly reflects winemaking techniques. There are also many a CA Chard that I've had my nose in on a blind taste and thought I was in the Beaune, etc. Now, in most cases, there are of course other tell-tale signs that would lead you away from Burgundy and toward the New World, so the final assessment might not end up in Burgundy, but the point remains...Burgundy is obviously one of the models others follow in the production of Chard.
So, why not just buy Burgs??? Easy...Price! I can sell that Hamilton-Russell for a lot less than a Meursault and I need that kind of quality at different price points because not everyone wants to, or can, spend the $$ on a Burgundy...
Now, you'll notice when I brought up the De Toren, I didn't compare it to another style, because that wine IS indeed a good example of what a uniquely SA wine can taste like...
 
Posts: 142 | Registered: Aug 19, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by jorgerunfrombulls:
quote:
Originally posted by wine+art:
quote:
Originally posted by Audrey Shannon:
How about just a Red Blend in General? I personally love a good red blend. The controversy... So many people want 100% the varietal, and have this pre-conceived notion that it's not worth drinking if not.. Well as most of us know. For years wines have been blended! And they are hot sellers right now.


Confused


+1

wth Confused


Audrey, I think you have confused us all. Could you clarify this "red blend" to which you were referring? A good chunk of the red wines on the market are blends of some sort.
 
Posts: 1639 | Location: Murrieta, CA | Registered: Mar 14, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
we did a 1984 tasting blind.

the silveroak was the best of the bunch out of

caymus ss,
opus one
heitz martha
bv gdl
and basically the rest of the "heavy hitters" from napa.


Different era. They earned their reputation before becoming an industrial level producer. There is zero basis to compare what they did then to what they do now.

The one I tried semi-recently was all about fancy oak over simple, somewhat odd, fruit. With about an hour in the glass it completely fell apart into an undrinkable mess. I've never had a young wine fall apart like that. Based on quality, with a different label, it would be at home at Trader Joe's for $8, and an easy pass.
 
Posts: 1789 | Location: Mountain View, CA | Registered: Oct 18, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by yhn:

Different era. They earned their reputation before becoming an industrial level producer. There is zero basis to compare what they did then to what they do now.


yhn, In your opinion, around what year (vintage) did the "deterioration" start?


"The hardest thing to attain ... is the appreciation of difference without insisting on superiority" George Saintsbury
 
Posts: 1687 | Location: DC Suburbs, Potomac MD. | Registered: Dec 12, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by yhn:
quote:
Originally posted by g-man:
we did a 1984 tasting blind.

the silveroak was the best of the bunch out of

caymus ss,
opus one
heitz martha
bv gdl
and basically the rest of the "heavy hitters" from napa.


Different era. They earned their reputation before becoming an industrial level producer. There is zero basis to compare what they did then to what they do now.

The one I tried semi-recently was all about fancy oak over simple, somewhat odd, fruit. With about an hour in the glass it completely fell apart into an undrinkable mess. I've never had a young wine fall apart like that. Based on quality, with a different label, it would be at home at Trader Joe's for $8, and an easy pass.


dunno the only other bottle of silver oak i had is from 1987.

I was simply pointing out that I acutally liked silver oak from what i've tried.


This is my sig -> www.brownteacup.com
www.wsqwine.com
(Wine distributor)
 
Posts: 12483 | Location: NYC | Registered: Feb 16, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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With Silver Oak, I think it's a little different whether we're dealing with the Alexander or Napa. But, in general, I find those who are not fans are usually not great lovers of American oak....just an observation...
 
Posts: 142 | Registered: Aug 19, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Stefania Wine:
Has no one said Silver Oak?

Is there a wine more loved by the masses and more hated by wine geeks and professionals? I saw three "Life is a Cabernet" license plates yesterday alone.

Rombauer Chardonnay would be second.


I would have figured Opus One beats out Silver Oak in terms of divisiveness. It seems to have been relegated, by many here, to just a show-off expense account wine that is a shadow of its former glory and no where near the QPR it should be. Maybe that horse has been beaten so badly its no longer considered fun sport.


If opportunity doesn't knock, build a door.
 
Posts: 473 | Location: Minneapolis | Registered: Aug 01, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by finz:
quote:
Originally posted by Stefania Wine:
Has no one said Silver Oak?

Is there a wine more loved by the masses and more hated by wine geeks and professionals? I saw three "Life is a Cabernet" license plates yesterday alone.

Rombauer Chardonnay would be second.


I would have figured Opus One beats out Silver Oak in terms of divisiveness. It seems to have been relegated, by many here, to just a show-off expense account wine that is a shadow of its former glory and no where near the QPR it should be. Maybe that horse has been beaten so badly its no longer considered fun sport.


Maybe, as pointed out by others, it is a case of when a good wine 'jumped the shark.'

We just had a '92 Opus and it was killer fantastico. Nothing more could have been asked of it, it was so good.

It priced itself out of my life a decade (and a half) or so ago, so I can't speak for newer vintages.

We drank 1990 Silver Oak Napa and a Bonny's last Thanksgiving and they were fab, too.


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"What is man, when you come to think upon him, but a minutely set, ingenious machine for turning, with infinite artfulness, the red wine of Shiraz into urine?" -Isak Dinesen
 
Posts: 1294 | Location: Chico, CA | Registered: May 05, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I love Red Blends.. But in my line of work some people are very biased about them. That is what I meant. I have found on several occasions, if someone asks if this is a blend, they are perturbed and do not want to bother trying it! It's sad they are missing out. Some of my favorite wines are blends.
 
Posts: 48 | Location: Clearlake Oaks, Ca | Registered: Feb 01, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Audrey Shannon:
I love Red Blends.. But in my line of work some people are very biased about them. That is what I meant. I have found on several occasions, if someone asks if this is a blend, they are perturbed and do not want to bother trying it! It's sad they are missing out. Some of my favorite wines are blends.

Audrey,

I have no doubt that fools exist. But it is hard to imagine anyone who actually drinks wine and enjoys it not knowing that, for example, many wines from the old world are labeled by region and consist of various grapes or that in order to call a CA wine by one singular grape it need only have 75% of that grape in the blend. I guess you meet lots of people in your line of work I would just prefer to remain ignorant of Wink

But, I'm with you, some of my favorite whites are blends, too. (White Graves, white Rhones, many Champagnes.) I like the red Haut-Brion, too. Smile


"What contemptible scoundrel stole the cork from my lunch?" -- W.C. Fields
 
Posts: 7678 | Registered: Dec 05, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I think that bias is diminishing, but in the '70s we entered an era where the move to varietal wines was synonymous with the move to quality. Suddenly, to be taken seriously it had to be a varietal wine. It didn't matter if that Cab was rounded out by 25% Merlot, it was a Cab. If the winemaker know the best wine would be a 65/35 blend they wouldn't do it because they'd have difficulty selling it for half of what they could get as a varietal.

A few did stand against this, but for each it was a huge marketing effort for each proprietary blend. Each a single exception to a rule. There's been a lot of progress, these aren't rare any more. But still...
 
Posts: 1789 | Location: Mountain View, CA | Registered: Oct 18, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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