I bought a bottle of this wine, not sure if it was an actual grape or a blend.

Looked it up online and they just say it's a Bdx style Red.

So it's a blend?

My bottle tasted like a heavy syrah, even zin blend

Your thoughts are appreciated..

"Claret" is a term the British used to describe a Bordeaux red. On a US wine bottle, the term may be used to describe a Bordeaux blend.

Like DoubleD said - it's pretty meaningless if it's on a US wine.

I don't think the French particularly care but the English have used it since Roman times to refer to wines shipped from Bordeaux to England, calling it "vinum clarum". Thru various iterations became known as clairet and later claret.

Nobody talked about things like physiological ripeness and over extraction until fairly recently, so pretty much any red wine up to the 19th or even the 20th century was likely going to be light-bodied and probably closer to what we would call a rose. There's some debate as to whether it referred to the color of the wine or the fact that the wine may have been clarified but I don't know why because the latter was not something routinely done until more recently, long after the name had been established.

So the word may actually have some legal meaning in Europe, I'm not entirely certain about that. But if it does, it only means red Bordeaux, and wouldn't include grapes from other regions.

Which if you think about it, is historically wrong anyhow, since the wines from Bordeaux were blended at the docks and routinely included wines from the Rhone, such as syrah. Moreover, they didn't even MAKE wine in Bordeaux when the Romans were shipping the stuff. Bordeaux was only important as a port, not as a wineproducing region since the grapes never really ripened well there. So if you see the word on a US wine containing syrah, it's meaningless, but in a weird way, maybe not entirely wrong.

Obviously I have too much time on my hands today . . .

Most likely a blend of Cabernet, Merlot and Cabernet Franc.

GregT, you're just showing off now!

quote:

Originally posted by mpls wine guy:
Most likely a blend of Cabernet, Merlot and Cabernet Franc.

Actually, the "noble" Bordeaux red varietals include Cabernet Sauvignon, Merlot, Cabernet Franc, Petit Verdot and Malbec. The white Bordeaux varietals include Sauvignon Blanc, Semillon, and Sauvignon Vert. I've never seen a white wine that was composed of the Bordeaux varietals referred to as a "Claret" though.

I've found the term "Claret" is misused just as the term "Meritage" is. Gary V of WLTV is known to do this. If any red is a blend of three or more grapes, regardless of what they are, Gary refers to it as a Meritage. This is confusing to consumers since only those wines composed of Bordeaux varietals should be labeled as a Meritage.

quote:

Originally posted by Altaholic:

quote:

Originally posted by mpls wine guy:
Most likely a blend of Cabernet, Merlot and Cabernet Franc.

Actually, the "noble" Bordeaux red varietals include Cabernet Sauvignon, Merlot, Cabernet Franc, Petit Verdot and Malbec. The white Bordeaux varietals include Sauvignon Blanc, Semillon, and Sauvignon Vert. I've never seen a white wine that was composed of the Bordeaux varietals referred to as a "Claret" though.

I've found the term "Claret" is misused just as the term "Meritage" is. Gary V of WLTV is known to do this. If any red is a blend of three or more grapes, regardless of what they are, Gary refers to it as a Meritage. This is confusing to consumers since only those wines composed of Bordeaux varietals should be labeled as a Meritage.

Malbec or Cot?

quote:

I've found the term "Claret" is misused just as the term "Meritage" is.

That's exactly right. In fact, I thought the term "meritage" was sort of falling out of favor since it never really took off. Too bad since it wasn't a bad idea.

There are actually a few people in CA who called their wine claret. I think it should only be for European wines but I guess they didn't ask me.

Wineaux - sorry about that. With apologies, here is something else -

There is still a wine produced today that is probably as close as one will ever get to the claret of old. Back in the days of Pepys, who was the first known writer to refer to a French Bordeaux by name, claret was what they drank. But since the English and French were just as likely to be at war as at peace, they needed other wine suppliers. So they got Rioja, which they called the "poor man's claret". Lopez de Heredia, which was only founded in the late 1800s, makes a wine that is probably more similar to the old Bordeaux claret than the current Bordeaux is.

The place where Samuel Pepys used to hang out and drink is still in operation in London. So like an idiot I went there, planning to order a goblet of their finest claret and act all seventeenth century. No dice. But I did order the steak and kidney pie, which pretty much made me want to puke, and followed that up with a few pints of lukewarm beer, which completed the job.

Anyhow, if they had to eat that steak and kidney pie, no wonder they drank so much wine.

quote:

Originally posted by markintokyo:
Malbec or Cot?

If I am not mistaken, Cot IS Malbec and is just the name that is used in Cahors for Malbec. No?

Just discovered the discusssion forum. Neat!

Isn't one differenc between "Claret" and "Meritage" that Claret is just used as a slang term for BDX blends while Meritage is actually used on bottleing as an official term?

I heard that "meritage" came about as a result of a contest hosted by the Napa Valley Growers Association to describe a high quality wine comprised of traditional BDX blends. At the time, without 80% of a single grape in your bottle you had to label it "red table wine". That had a cheap connotation. So, some guy in Iowa or somehwere submitted "meritage" as a crosss between the terms "marriage" (of the grape varietals) and "heritage" (refering to traditonal blending and style. So, know you can label your wine "Meritage".

What I don't know is...

Are there are BDX actually labeled "Claret"? I've never seen one, but I didn't pay close attention last time I was in a supermarket in France.

Also, does the word "Caret" in the US have any regulation tied to its use on a wine bottle?

Cheers!
Matt

Matt - that's right - meritage is a trademarked term that the growers agreed on. As such, it has a legal meaning. And yes, they did hold a contest to come up with that name.

As I had posted, claret is merely the informal name that the English applied to Bordeaux. To my knowledge, the French don't use it to label their wine because they are interested in promoting their appellations, not English slang. It actually does have some legal standing in the EU because of the English - they claimed that they had used it for hundreds of years and obviously, they don't have any appellation to promote. But French bottles say Bordeaux, not the English word claret.

In the US it's something along the lines of "natural". I.e., it's used solely for marketing and has no legal meaning. At least I haven't found any case law where use of the term was at issue and I can't imagine a cause of action based on misuse of an informal term from another country.

http://www.meritagewine.org/

Claret is a restricted term on U.S. bottles.

From the TTB:

Angelica (U.S.)
Burgundy (France)
Claret (France)
Chablis (France)
Champagne (France)
Chianti (Italy)
Haut Sauterne (France)
Hock (Germany)
Malaga (Spain)
Marsala (Italy)
Madeira (Portugal)
Moselle (France)
Port (Portugal)
Rhine Wine (Germany)
Sauterne (France)
Sherry (Spain)
Tokay (Hungary)

On March 10, 2006, the U.S. and the European Union (EU) signed an Agreement on Trade in Wine in which the U.S. committed to seek to change the legal status of the above names (with the exception of Angelica which is a U.S. wine and therefore not included in the Agreement) to restrict their use solely to wine originating in the applicable EU member state, except as provided for under a "grandfather" provision. The "grandfather" provision excepts certain non-EU wines labeled with one of the above names (other than Angelica) provided the applicable label was approved on a certificate of label approval (COLA) or certificate of exemption issued before March 10, 2006. The legislative proposal that effected the change in legal status of the names was included in the Tax Relief and Health Care Act of 2006 that was enacted on December 20, 2006. (If you would like to read more about this, please see the U.S./EC Wine Agreement page.)



What does all that mean?

Wine that is not from Bordeaux can not be labled as 'Claret'.

I don't know of any wine from Bordeaux that is in fact labeled 'Claret'. I don't think such a wine exists.

Exception:

If you are a US manufacturer and you had used the term 'Claret" prior to Dec 2006, you can continue to do so, but no new lable approvals will be granted with that term.


There were no legal requirements on what could or does go into a wine labeled as 'Claret'. I think most wine labeled 'Claret' is in fact wine made from grapes grown in the Central Valley and sold in boxes or jugs.

A few quality producers do make wines they label "Claret" (Foley has a 'Claret' and Cooper Garrod has an 'R.V.'s Fine Claret'). These wines generally have the Bordeaux blending grapes in some combination, but there is no requirement that they do.

Alright Paul. So at least Steltzner, Coppola, Newton and a few others would still be able to make their claret.

Weird list because Tokay, Sherry, and Burgundy are English spellings of foreign places but Claret is not, nor is it even used by the French themselves.

I very vaguely remember that agreement but also remember thinking that in 2006 it wasn't like the US was going be particularly accomodating to the Europeans, and I guessed that nothing would happen.

Do you know if the changes were ever made?

The agreement did not call for anything immediate; e.g. the quote from the circular only says that the U.S. only committed to seek to change the legal status of the semi-generic names.

That was right around the time that they agreed to cut carbon emissions by 20% and cut food tarrifs. Obviously an aspirational agreement, not a commitment, the kind lawyers love because it's so vague it's almost impossible to breech it.

Thanks for the info.

More info if anyone wants to read regulations:
http://search.treas.gov/search?output=xml_no_dtd&client=ttb&site=ttb&proxystylesheet=ttb&q=semi+generic+names&image.x=0&image.y=0

A quick search of WS reviews shows about 60 producers using the word Claret. A few show up in my own cellar; Basel, Robert Carl, and Matthews from Washington, Cliff Lede and Ramey from California. Others I've had recently are Del Rio and Tyrus Evan from southern Oregon.

The word shows up in wine from the additional states of Colorado, Michigan, Missouri, Nevada, North Carolina, New York, Texas, and Virginia, and the countries of Australia, Chile, and one, Chateau Grand Claret, from a little known area called Bordeaux.

The law is in effect, no COLA will be issued for 'Claret' going forward. I mean I could try if anyone is curious, it doesn't cost anything, but at a TTB seminar last year they were very clear about this. If you already have a COLA, you can continue to use it, but no new ones.

I thought 'Claret' was particularly lame and showed a certain hypocracy from the French. They have always contended that the value is in a 'place name'. 'Claret' is not a place, or even a term used outside of the English speaking countries. It's clearly a branding name and despite French claims they are trying to protect thier unique places, protecting 'Claret', runs counter to that and shows it's the branding they are fighting to protect.

I've got no problem with that, just the hypocracy of saying one thing when you mean another.

There is a "Bordeaux Clairet AOC" and a "Bordeaux Superieur Clairet AOC". Both are for light bodied reds and the "Clairet" is optional. I do recall having one of the former once.

"Claret" was a common term in CA wine in the days before varietal labeling became common.