I saw some less positive reactions / TNs of members on Ch.Haut-Brion '97. I just bought some bottles with a nice discount, these being my first First Growths, as I think their prices sometimes are terrible.

Can anyone tell me when these well stored Brions are at their best? I'm more of a 'mature Bordeaux drinker', and I only like 'velvety tannins'. WS said until 2004, H.B. itself sais 2005-2010+...

Anyone with cheerful notes and advice?

And as a finishing touch, God created the Dutch!

DutchDrinker, I hope this helps. A few of the chicago board members tasted this about a month ago. Here is the link to our discussion.

http://forums.winespectator.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&s=9306023451&f=3146091161&m=3016098561

Then please excuse my saying so, but what are you doing buying Bordeaux?

You say you like mature Bordeaux - you may be able to gauge when to drink the Haut-Brion based on your discovered preferences. What has been the average age of the average mature Bordeaux you have enjoyed?

Take that figure and add a couple of years, because although reviews have varied, the H-B has generally been described as having a big tannic structure.

"When will it be at its best?" For you, that will apparently be at a later date, since you like your Bordeaux mature.

I am currently drinking a '97 Haut Medoc, Guittot-Felloneau, which is drinking marvellously now, with not quite "velvety" but well-integrated tannins.

I would drink a bottle at Christmas and see what you think, unless what you particularly have enjoyed are 13 year old Bordeaux. Then again, have you drunk any 6 year old? You might like them.

You note WS says '04 and HB says '05. RP said '01. I tend to go with the winemaker. I mean, he makes the wine, sells it to you and says "Don't drink this 'til 2005." Why would you think he is wrong?

Cheers, New Dutch Drinker, looks like you're in luck, RP mentions that the 1997 Haut Brion has velvety tannins, and you're within the drinking window,a s 1997 as a whole is very forward, and although not a great vintage, provides early drinking, especially of the top wines. I have not had the H-B but have had the 1997 Margaux, and while not a mind-blowing experience that you'd expect from a 1er cru, it's good, correct and ready, and will last for a few more years.

I have enjoyed a good amount of 1997 Bordeaux as they are relatively cheap, ready-to-drink, and the retailers need to make room for the 2000 vintage. A couple of my favourites have been Faugeres and Barde-Haut, both from St Emilion (merlot/cab franc varietals predominate) and well-priced.

Cheers.

"Abandon all hope ye who enter here."

R2-D2, thanks! Nice to see difference in opinion. Seems to me there's a world of difference between 'a generous 90' and '92pts'.

Ervin, I used the term 'velvety tannins' more as an indication than as a specification. I think Parker uses 'velvety tannins' when there are no tannins left? The best 'mature' Bordeaux I had recently were from 1989, 1985 and even 1976. These were all 'fruity' enough, but also had that 'extra thing' when good Bordeaux is growing older. I also had some '97 Haut-Medoc and found them all very joyful and fresh, but some of them were lacking power. They're much more open (to me) than '96 and '95.

TuaRita, didn't Parker himself invent 'velvety tannins'? I agree that the vintage itself is a bargain now, much more than the 99ers (also meant for early drinking).

And as a finishing touch, God created the Dutch!